Re "Don't you read" posted by john dawson at 16:31 28/04/07 ...
well for 16yrs i had a mortgage with abbey on a house i owned down south,then i moved to Aberdeen & sold that property. I then phoned abbey's mortgage dept & told them i wanted to buy an old blacksmiths to convert to a 4bed house,i even spoke to the head of the dept Craig Driver who promised me the earth no problem. Thats where the problems begain, i was told that at that time abbey where having there computer & phone lines upgraded,so every day i wanted to contact the mortgage dept, i had to phone the belfast office [ advertising & promotions] so they could get me up on there computer to put me through to the mortgage dept [who did'nt have a clue who i was if i phoned them direct]. the person i spoke to on that day would then give me a reference number wich meant absolutly nothing to the person i spoke to the next day [which was allways someone else as the person i had spoken to was allways on a training day or busy or out of the office etc] This went on for 3months which took me way past the completion date & in Scotland thats �37 a day. After spending hours upon hours, day after day & going into both abbey branches in Aberdeen to sign paperwork that the mortgage dept said they never got. They asked me if i was taking the roof off, when isaid yes. I was told oh well we dont do mortgages if you're taking the roof off. so on the 03-12-07 I went into Abbey in Peterhead & told them i wanted to close my current account as i no longer wanted to bank with them. I was told i had to give 2wks notice. I then whent back 29-01-08 withdrew all of my money & closed my account. So you can imagine my confusion & upset when in sept 08 i get a nasty phone call from a United debt recovery demanding i confirm my name & address because they have brought my 'dept' from abbey, apparently abbey never closed my account untill August,wich made no sense to me espescialy as i had no overdraft on the account even when it was open. So now i am in the middle of a staged release mortgage with Lloyds & have been told i have a ccj against my name which is causing problems. I have contacted the Ombudsman & hope they can sort this mess out soon as i am paying rent & mortgage on a property that has'nt been completed yet. So if anybody can help out with some more advice please feel free to contact me. so in answer to your letter. Even if your account is in credit, abbey will still find a way to f*ck you up & it's not a case of one hand not knowing what the others up to, it's neither hand has a clue what it's up to
yours p*ss*d off [with abbey
ABBEY is top of the Bad Banks League, according to our bulging postbag.
Banks are dishing out millions of pounds to compensate for unfair fees. The Abbey National Britain's sixth biggest bank has attracted four times as many complaints about bank charges from Money Mail readers as any other current account provider since we began our Fair Play on Charges campaign two weeks ago.
Some of the complaints are from customers who have not used their accounts for years but have been caught out by an unauthorised bank charge implemented since Abbey was taken over by Banco Santander.
This charge has seen current accountholders - who for years had been only a few pence overdrawn - suddenly rack up hundreds of pounds of charges, even though they have done nothing.
Almost half of all letters, emails and phone calls about unfair charges have been about Abbey.
BANKING BADDIES: Abbey tops our league of the worst banks
The flood of letters from fed-up Abbey customers reveals a pattern that started on October 5, 2005 when Banco Santander implemented a �20 unauthorised overdraft fee.
Prior to that date, Abbey customers were charged only for payments that were authorised by the bank and took them further into the red, or those that were bounced, so if you were slightly overdrawn and made no further transactions you would not incur any other charges.
One customer told how she thought she had closed her Abbey account six years ago, only to receive a letter in November last year saying she was �1.45 overdrawn and that she had been charged a �20 unauthorised overdraft fee. To avoid any hassle, she decided to pay the �21.45 total.
But two months later, she received a second letter saying she now owed �40 for two more overdraft charges - �20 because the first overdraft had crossed over into a second month, and another �20 because the first fee had made her overdrawn again. That's some �60 in fees on an account that had not been used for six years.
Another cAbbey customer had forgotten about an Abbey account that had been �5.04 overdrawn for more than a year. In March, her husband discovered that for the previous five months �120 of unauthorised overdraft charges had been mounting up. Abbey is now demanding they pay back a total of �127, including interest.
Spanish banking giant Banco Santander bought loss-making Abbey in November 2004 and pledged to turn the UK bank around in two years. It cut costs by slashing jobs, and introduced new products and charges. In February this year, Abbey reported half-year profits of �596m.
The unauthorised overdraft fee is generated automatically by computer. All accounts were scanned to detect overdrafts, and irrespective of the amount or the account's history, the charge was applied.
Abbey charges �20 for every month you are in an unauthorised overdraft, plus �35 for every direct debit, standing order or cheque it bounces while you are overdrawn, and there is also a �30 charge for every payment it authorises that takes you overdrawn or further into the red.
Our table shows the current positions in the Bad Banks League. We will update it regularly until the banks start playing fair on charges.
IT HAD been years since Patricia Darbyshire had even looked at her Abbey current account. She knew she was 88p overdrawn, but she was unconcerned and did nothing about it.
Suddenly, in December last year, Mrs Darbyshire, 49, from Penwortham, near Preston, received notification that she would be charged �20 for the overdraft. The same thing has happened every month since, so she now owes �140.88.
Mrs Darbyshire says: 'I didn't do anything with the account - no debits, no credits. I haven't used my account, so how come I suddenly owe an extra �140?'
The Law Is Quite Clear On This
IF YOU HAVE BEEN CHARGED EXCESSIVE PENALTY FEES/CHARGES BY YOUR BANK OVER THE LAST SIX YEARS, YOU CAN TAKE THEM TO COUNTY COURT TO RECOVER THOSE FEES AND IT WON'T COST YOU A PENNY IF YOU RECIEVE INCOME SUPPORT BENEFIT, JOB SEEKERS ALLOWANCE, OR YOU MIGHT HAVE TO PAY A REDUCED FEE IF YOU GET FAMILY TAX CREDITS.IF YOU HAVE NO JOY IN YOUR CONTACT WITH THE BANK, JUST POP ALONG TO YOUR COUNTY COURT OFFICES AND FILL IN A SHORT FORM WITH 2 PROOF OF ID, AND PROOF THAT YOU ARE GETTING BENEFIT, THEN AFTER FILLING IN THAT FORM, FILL IN THE COUNTY COURT FORM TO ISSUE THE SUMMONS AT THE SAME TIME AND THAT'S IT.GET THE BALL ROLLING, GET THOSE CHARGES BACK.SHOW THEM YOU ARE NOT MESSING ABOUT, IT'S EASY,AND IF YOU WERE WORRIED ABOUT THE COST, DON'T BE, PROVIDED YOU FALL IN THE CATAGORY ABOVE, IT WON'T COST YOU ANYTHING...NOTHING TO LOSE, EVERYTHING TO GAIN....GOOD LUCK TO YOU ALLBANKS DON'T WANT CCJ'Sget your money back !
Banks Being Greedy, This problem arises from the banks using poverty as a source of profit�a great deal of profit. The bank commission of BBC 2's "The Money Programme", which included eminent business academics and a former senior NatWest executive, concluded that the absolute maximum administrative cost to a bank of processing a bounced cheque�the most labour-intensive of the processes in question�is �4.50. For all other items, such as unauthorised overdrafts or bounced direct debits, the commission concluded that the absolute maximum, in this electronic age where everything is done automatically through a computer, is �2.50. However, the average charge is approximately �30. Some are as high as �38, and they are charged every time people make what the banks consider to be an unauthorised transaction. That is a substantial profit for the banks, which rake in some �4.5 billion, without even taking account of the similar examples that the Federation of Small Businesses found in business banking accounts.
Almost all of what is charged is profit, not costs. It is profit at the expense of hard-up customers. It is the biggest bank robbery in Britain, and it involves the banks robbing their own customers, especially their poorest ones. A common response when the practice is described is that there should be a law against it; but there is a law, or there are laws. First, under common law, disproportionate and punitive charges have always been illegal. In layman's terms, if a consumer breaks the contract the other party�the bank, in this case�cannot impose a charge greater than the reasonable estimate of its loss. That common law has been unchanged for 100 years, and numerous cases in the higher courts have confirmed it. However, we can go further. The rights in question are protected by statutory instrument. The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 made that clear.
Details for the contacts at The Abbey National Bank Are Below.
You will find details on the internet regarding contacting other banks.
ABBEY NATIONAL BANK
Get Your Money Back
Telephone Direct and claim your bank charges back
MR TOM JERRED
SENIOR CUSTOMER RELATION MANAGER
0845 600 6014
Ask to Speak to him direct
PAM SPEED
BANKING SERVICING
08457 654321
Ask to Speak to her direct
MR RICHARD JONES
SENIOR MANAGER
08706076000
Ask to speak to him direct
[edit by GT ref AUP)
Other people working for this bank accepting your complaints who you can contact are
Laura Dunraven 08459 724 724
and guess what, yes
The Head of Complaints Dick Harris
0845 600 6014
You probably have to mow your way through 45 minutes of blasts from the past, 5 more muppets somewhere in Milton Keynes or Delhi and an automated service before you actually can speak to him but persistance will eventually pay off.
If not, send them an email to [email protected]
At the moment they are using your money and interest on your money to carry out an 8 week investigation to justify charges in which they pressed a few buttons on their keyboards to inform you that you were overdrawn by anything over 1p, or you didn't have a direct debit paid because of lack of funds or they had to bounce a cheque because of lack of funds in you account.
For the buttons pressed and the sheet of A4 paper which was sent out to you which was automated they will be charging you in the region of �35.00 ( But they did have to pay the postage, ) and being generous, that is included in your charge which they will take next month).
On very rare occasions it may have been passed to a different department downstairs to see if the transaction could be approved.
This Hard to come by YES OR No Answer obviously has to be done manually and does takes time, probably including thinking time approx 12 seconds which means that altogether the time involved with pressing the keyboard is around 40 seconds.
Materials involved, 1 sheet of A4 paper, Ink, Envelope & Stamp plus overheads probably works out at around �4.00 Maximum, which is what the experts say.
the banks make profits of around 4.5 Billion Per Year
which you can see whilst they are getting �35 of your hard earned cash each time and a total of ( �29.00 ) profit for an absolute maximum of 3 minutes work, means they love you.
They don't want to pay you back and have enough of your money which they have stole from you over the years to carry on fighting and disputing this.
But unfortunately the law is the law and even though Dick Turpin wore a mask and the bank's don't have to, they will be brought to justice eventually.
Computers play a major part becase they do the work in seconds not like years ago when EVERYTHING was done manually.
Banks have forgotten this and forgotten the respect for thir customers.
Get your money back.
After around 8 weeks you will get a letter saying their charges have been applied correctly and they are not going to refund.
So for 8 weeks they have been milling around in their departments, taking coffee breaks, painting their nails, pressing buttons on their keyboard adding up their charges which they imposed upon you, and then one final press sending a message to the printer and the letter goes out to you.
What a complete and utter waste of time and resources.
If you pursue, you will get your money back, why don't they all just do the right thing and refund straight away.
They just love spending your money, wasting their own time, the court's time and yours, don't bother take them to Court, Its easy and you will win.
Oh and by the way, some people are worried saying that they signed a contract with the bank and agreed with the bank�s charges when they opened the account.
This makes no difference, what the banks have been doing is unlawful, they are only allowed to charge you the ACTUAL cost involved and it is unlawful to make any profit, that is why millions of �s are being refunded every week and obviously you will have seen the law firms willing to take cases up, the consumer watchdog, BBC, the newspapers, solicitors, Internet sites etc.
The contract becomes worthless when it is unlawful and this is why the banks are refunding.
They could put any amount on the leaflets �2000.00 if they wanted to, it does not make it lawful, It�s like somebody saying to you that they are going to run you over in their car, and then they do it, it does not mean it�s ok because they told you before they did it.
The case for the banks is that there is no case, they have admitted to making 4.5 Billion profit and a huge chunk of that being made from penalty charges, which is deemed unlawful..
That is why they are refunding�.
Get your money back��.
Go to either
moneysavingexpert.com
watch the video on reclaiming bank charges
or goto
penaltycharges.co.uk
Good Luck
The Latest Tel Hotline For the refund of Abbey National bank Charges is
In June I had to deal with my deceased sons affairs, after calling at a few places of which I was
treated only with compassion politeness & respect, that was until I called at the Keighley branch
of Abbey. What should have been a simply explanation,even the most junior of staff should have
been able to explain the procedure with the words �we can:t close the account at this stage,but
we can freeze it until the final death certificate is produced�. That,s how it should have been. However no member of staff was able to do this, which resulted in me asking to see the manager,
A manager with a very bad attitude, she obviously doesn't know what the word respect means.
I complained to the complaints department of which I explained the situation They passed it on to her , she responded with a letter of which her attitude reflects yet again. She blamed her staff and myself accusing me of DEMANDING to see her ect ,but still no mention of her attitude. Its quite clear to me she is not going to take any responsibility for her the way in which she treated me with the contempt that she did. She is a disrespectful arrogant person who is not worthy of being a manager I later received a letter from someone who was supposed to be investigating my
complaint and once more there was no mention regarding her attitude,That letter also came from
the Keighley branch,I replied to this person too but I have had no response. I have apologised for my misunderstanding So because neither the manager or anyone from Abbey has the decency to
bring this unfortunate situation to an amicable end I feel the only way I can put it to rest is to let
as many people know what to expect from Abbey when you feel the need to complain be prepared to be ignored .
This situation has also made me think how many so called customers Abbey really do have, or are
a good number of them just names of deceased people who's accounts have never been closed.
Lastly I would like to say to any potential new customers THINK TWICE
from a very dismayed person
Hows this for abbey customer service. My mother has her purse stolen, reports to the police the problem, gets incident number etc, and is told to go straight to her bank in the same high street where her acct is held and get cards stopped. Stand in queue for 30 minutes, then told cannot speak to anyone privately - has to be done in front of everyone. Then to add insult to injury we explain cards stolen, acct cards need to be stopped, was asked for bank statement to prove who she was, (even though driving licence with photo is produced). Was then told even though she had banked with them for 30 yrs that they couldnt find account. by this time i was very angry, told them to look again, and they found it, but because we did not go home and produce a bank statement to them they didnt cancel the cards. Found out person who stole the purse emptied �250.00 out of bank acct because they refused to cancel cards. How is that for abbey incompetence. So now until this person is found my mother is down �250 in her acct. Needless to say we have been to barclays and am getting it changed over.
I am incredibly shocked just how bad Abbey National is. Virtually every time I deal with them they mess up. Most recently i have saved up foor months to pay off some of the capital on my interest only mortage - I go into a branch - have a long conversation with teh cashier confirming that I am making a capital repayment (not interest) and have just got a letter saying they Abbet have only made an interst only payment - so again i lose out after bus saving. I just can't believe how much hassle they cause when money is so tight for so many people - am just so upset. It's just on the back of a long line of things Abbey have messed up.
I do sorry for call centre people - because they do get a lot of abuse - but to be honest I don't think the call centre people are trained properly to be dealing with bank issues eg once I called up to confirms my mortage options - and a week later i found out that the call centre woman had cancelled the mortage I had previously signed and agreed on (the day before I was completing on my flat). Was a fun day trying to siort that out! Just everythinbg they do is wrong.
ABBEY IS THE WORST BANK I HAVE EVER DELT WITH. I DEPOSITED 500 POUNDS WITH THEM 4 MONTHS AGO AND HAVE BEEN TRYING TO GET IT BACK FOR THE LAST 3. THEY ARE INTOLERABLE. AND AS FOR THE INNOCENT CALL CENTRE FOLK, I SUGGEST YOU FIND ANOTHER JOB IF YOU DONT LIKE BEING YELLED AT. YOUR ON THE FRONT LINE. AND GUESS WHAT, THE BIG BOSS DONT CARE.
My father died in May since which time, as Executor, I have had to deal with NatWest, Birmingham Midshires, L&G, Northern Rock, Threadneedle, NS&I and Abbey in closing down his various accounts. All of them,other than Abbey, have cooperated reasonably efficiently and helped me discharge my duties as Executor. Abbey, however, has been stupendously obstructive, difficult and unhelpful despite many 'phone calls, emails and letters most of which have been ignored. Like a previous sufferer (Disgrunted) who posted a complaint on Grumbletext in January 2006 the so called Probate department in Abbey has claimed I never sent them the death certificate despite the fact I have a letter from them acknowledging its receipt when they returned it and the grant of probate to me!! They seem to have learned nothing since Disgrunted had the same experience in 2006. At the very least the ISA Office in Glasgow is inefficient and at worst deliberately unhelpful and obstructive. I was not at all surprised to find so many complaints about Abbey on the internet and to learn of its reputation as one of the worst banks. I have had nothing to do with Abbey in the past and obviously will have nothing to do with it in the future once this is all sorted out. It does seem odd to me that when executors are in the position of having to find a suitable home for inherited funds that the probate department of a bank like Abbey should be so obstructive and unhelpful that no executor in his right mind would dream of investing in their products. Ignoring letters, phone calls and emails is unacceptable as it is for Abbey's Call Centre advisers to promise action and 'phone calls which never come about. I realise Call Centre jobs are poorly paid dead-end jobs but dealing with the death of a family member as executor is no fun either. At the other end of the scale would I be right in assuming that the chairman of Abbey is so well paid that he might not care either and that the danger is that there might be an institutionalised 'don't care' attitude throughout Abbey from top to bottom? Of the financial institutions I have dealt with after my father's death Birmingham Midshires and Threadneedle were by far the most helpful and efficient. I am sure Abbey managers avoid reading Grumbletext because of the embarassment it would cause them but they really ought to take lessons from these institutions on how to deal with accounts after the death of the account holder.
An Abbey 'customer relations' adviser in the Glasgow ISA office told me it does not have a complaints department so I wrote to Abbey's chairman and the chief executive (although I am not so naive as to expect a reply) but the following day I found the address of the official complaints office for Abbey in Milton Keynes! I have written to them also but without any great hope or expectation because I fear the 'don't care' attitude may have infected the whole of Abbey.
Just reading through all ur posts and i can see most of them are negative. Can i just say, i work in one of the personal banking call centres for Abbey and its a real shame that only the negative experiences seemed to get talked about as there are alot of good experiences that i hear of and deal with on a daily basis. As for the Indian call centres then everyone is entitled to their own opinion and as i am an abbey a/c holder myself i regularly use telephone banking and trust me some of the advisors are very good over there and get alot of attitude from callers, even people i work with that have a different accent get alot of abuse and they arent even in india. All i ask is that people remember they are human beings after all even though sometimes it may be difficult to keep this in mnd since its just a "voice"on the phone.
cheers
Look Lo Bocks
It is not our fault you work for the Abbey and unfortunately you chose that path in life.
As you are probably one of the people we try and speak to from time to time without success then you already know what we think of you lot.
Advice is get a proper job with a proper company and learn to respond to customer queries.
Alright people get a grip. Banks are not charities they don't provide accounts out of the goodness of their hearts you should have your money in your account to pay your bills, if you don't then tough luck! Expect to get charged, i mean have you been walking around with your head up your ass your whole life. If you don't have the money expect to be penalised. End of story!
A penalty or being penalised is what it is all about,
It's about what is right and what is lawful and unlawful, charges are ok, it is the amount of charges what is the issue here.
banks are refunding to thousands of customers every day because they know that the amount of charges is unlawful.
The charge can only reflect what it actually costs to administer it and that cost is esitimated at �4.50 absolute maximum.
It becomes unlawful if the banks make ANY kind of profit from a charge or penalty and they have already admitted that a huge portion of the 4.5 Billion profit from last year comes from penalty charges.
Of course they are allowed to make a charge, it is the actual amount that is unlawful.
Go to moneysavingexpert.com and watch the video on bank charges.
Any contract that was signed when you opened a bank account becomes worthless because the charges are not justified.
Under British Law, as well as under consumer contract regulations of 1999, a charge or penalty exceeding the actual cost to administer the transaction is unlawful and that is why millions of �s are being refunded every week to customers.
ABBEY is top of the Bad Banks League, according to our bulging postbag.
Banks are dishing out millions of pounds to compensate for unfair fees. The Abbey National Britain's sixth biggest bank has attracted four times as many complaints about bank charges from Money Mail readers as any other current account provider since we began our Fair Play on Charges campaign two weeks ago.
Some of the complaints are from customers who have not used their accounts for years but have been caught out by an unauthorised bank charge implemented since Abbey was taken over by Banco Santander.
This charge has seen current accountholders - who for years had been only a few pence overdrawn - suddenly rack up hundreds of pounds of charges, even though they have done nothing.
Almost half of all letters, emails and phone calls about unfair charges have been about Abbey.
BANKING BADDIES: Abbey tops our league of the worst banks
The flood of letters from fed-up Abbey customers reveals a pattern that started on October 5, 2005 when Banco Santander implemented a �20 unauthorised overdraft fee.
Prior to that date, Abbey customers were charged only for payments that were authorised by the bank and took them further into the red, or those that were bounced, so if you were slightly overdrawn and made no further transactions you would not incur any other charges.
One customer told how she thought she had closed her Abbey account six years ago, only to receive a letter in November last year saying she was �1.45 overdrawn and that she had been charged a �20 unauthorised overdraft fee. To avoid any hassle, she decided to pay the �21.45 total.
But two months later, she received a second letter saying she now owed �40 for two more overdraft charges - �20 because the first overdraft had crossed over into a second month, and another �20 because the first fee had made her overdrawn again. That's some �60 in fees on an account that had not been used for six years.
Another cAbbey customer had forgotten about an Abbey account that had been �5.04 overdrawn for more than a year. In March, her husband discovered that for the previous five months �120 of unauthorised overdraft charges had been mounting up. Abbey is now demanding they pay back a total of �127, including interest.
Spanish banking giant Banco Santander bought loss-making Abbey in November 2004 and pledged to turn the UK bank around in two years. It cut costs by slashing jobs, and introduced new products and charges. In February this year, Abbey reported half-year profits of �596m.
The unauthorised overdraft fee is generated automatically by computer. All accounts were scanned to detect overdrafts, and irrespective of the amount or the account's history, the charge was applied.
Abbey charges �20 for every month you are in an unauthorised overdraft, plus �35 for every direct debit, standing order or cheque it bounces while you are overdrawn, and there is also a �30 charge for every payment it authorises that takes you overdrawn or further into the red.
Our table shows the current positions in the Bad Banks League. We will update it regularly until the banks start playing fair on charges.
IT HAD been years since Patricia Darbyshire had even looked at her Abbey current account. She knew she was 88p overdrawn, but she was unconcerned and did nothing about it.
Suddenly, in December last year, Mrs Darbyshire, 49, from Penwortham, near Preston, received notification that she would be charged �20 for the overdraft. The same thing has happened every month since, so she now owes �140.88.
Mrs Darbyshire says: 'I didn't do anything with the account - no debits, no credits. I haven't used my account, so how come I suddenly owe an extra �140?'
The Law Is Quite Clear On This
IF YOU HAVE BEEN CHARGED EXCESSIVE PENALTY FEES/CHARGES BY YOUR BANK OVER THE LAST SIX YEARS, YOU CAN TAKE THEM TO COUNTY COURT TO RECOVER THOSE FEES AND IT WON'T COST YOU A PENNY IF YOU RECIEVE INCOME SUPPORT BENEFIT, JOB SEEKERS ALLOWANCE, OR YOU MIGHT HAVE TO PAY A REDUCED FEE IF YOU GET FAMILY TAX CREDITS.IF YOU HAVE NO JOY IN YOUR CONTACT WITH THE BANK, JUST POP ALONG TO YOUR COUNTY COURT OFFICES AND FILL IN A SHORT FORM WITH 2 PROOF OF ID, AND PROOF THAT YOU ARE GETTING BENEFIT, THEN AFTER FILLING IN THAT FORM, FILL IN THE COUNTY COURT FORM TO ISSUE THE SUMMONS AT THE SAME TIME AND THAT'S IT.GET THE BALL ROLLING, GET THOSE CHARGES BACK.SHOW THEM YOU ARE NOT MESSING ABOUT, IT'S EASY,AND IF YOU WERE WORRIED ABOUT THE COST, DON'T BE, PROVIDED YOU FALL IN THE CATAGORY ABOVE, IT WON'T COST YOU ANYTHING...NOTHING TO LOSE, EVERYTHING TO GAIN....GOOD LUCK TO YOU ALLBANKS DON'T WANT CCJ'Sget your money back !
Banks Being Greedy, This problem arises from the banks using poverty as a source of profit�a great deal of profit. The bank commission of BBC 2's "The Money Programme", which included eminent business academics and a former senior NatWest executive, concluded that the absolute maximum administrative cost to a bank of processing a bounced cheque�the most labour-intensive of the processes in question�is �4.50. For all other items, such as unauthorised overdrafts or bounced direct debits, the commission concluded that the absolute maximum, in this electronic age where everything is done automatically through a computer, is �2.50. However, the average charge is approximately �30. Some are as high as �38, and they are charged every time people make what the banks consider to be an unauthorised transaction. That is a substantial profit for the banks, which rake in some �4.5 billion, without even taking account of the similar examples that the Federation of Small Businesses found in business banking accounts.
Almost all of what is charged is profit, not costs. It is profit at the expense of hard-up customers. It is the biggest bank robbery in Britain, and it involves the banks robbing their own customers, especially their poorest ones. A common response when the practice is described is that there should be a law against it; but there is a law, or there are laws. First, under common law, disproportionate and punitive charges have always been illegal. In layman's terms, if a consumer breaks the contract the other party�the bank, in this case�cannot impose a charge greater than the reasonable estimate of its loss. That common law has been unchanged for 100 years, and numerous cases in the higher courts have confirmed it. However, we can go further. The rights in question are protected by statutory instrument. The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 made that clear.
Details for the contacts at The Abbey National Bank Are Below.
You will find details on the internet regarding contacting other banks.
ABBEY NATIONAL BANK
Get Your Money Back
Telephone Direct and claim your bank charges back
MR TOM JERRED
SENIOR CUSTOMER RELATION MANAGER
0845 600 6014
Ask to Speak to him direct
PAM SPEED
BANKING SERVICING
08457 654321
Ask to Speak to her direct
MR RICHARD JONES
SENIOR MANAGER
08706076000
Ask to speak to him direct
[edit by GT ref AUP)
Other people working for this bank accepting your complaints who you can contact are
Laura Dunraven 08459 724 724
and guess what, yes
The Head of Complaints Dick Harris
0845 600 6014
You probably have to mow your way through 45 minutes of blasts from the past, 5 more muppets somewhere in Milton Keynes or Delhi and an automated service before you actually can speak to him but persistance will eventually pay off.
If not, send them an email to [email protected]
At the moment they are using your money and interest on your money to carry out an 8 week investigation to justify charges in which they pressed a few buttons on their keyboards to inform you that you were overdrawn by anything over 1p, or you didn't have a direct debit paid because of lack of funds or they had to bounce a cheque because of lack of funds in you account.
For the buttons pressed and the sheet of A4 paper which was sent out to you which was automated they will be charging you in the region of �35.00 ( But they did have to pay the postage, ) and being generous, that is included in your charge which they will take next month).
On very rare occasions it may have been passed to a different department downstairs to see if the transaction could be approved.
This Hard to come by YES OR No Answer obviously has to be done manually and does takes time, probably including thinking time approx 12 seconds which means that altogether the time involved with pressing the keyboard is around 40 seconds.
Materials involved, 1 sheet of A4 paper, Ink, Envelope & Stamp plus overheads probably works out at around �4.00 Maximum, which is what the experts say.
the banks make profits of around 4.5 Billion Per Year
which you can see whilst they are getting �35 of your hard earned cash each time and a total of ( �29.00 ) profit for an absolute maximum of 3 minutes work, means they love you.
They don't want to pay you back and have enough of your money which they have stole from you over the years to carry on fighting and disputing this.
But unfortunately the law is the law and even though Dick Turpin wore a mask and the bank's don't have to, they will be brought to justice eventually.
Computers play a major part becase they do the work in seconds not like years ago when EVERYTHING was done manually.
Banks have forgotten this and forgotten the respect for thir customers.
Get your money back.
After around 8 weeks you will get a letter saying their charges have been applied correctly and they are not going to refund.
So for 8 weeks they have been milling around in their departments, taking coffee breaks, painting their nails, pressing buttons on their keyboard adding up their charges which they imposed upon you, and then one final press sending a message to the printer and the letter goes out to you.
What a complete and utter waste of time and resources.
If you pursue, you will get your money back, why don't they all just do the right thing and refund straight away.
They just love spending your money, wasting their own time, the court's time and yours, don't bother take them to Court, Its easy and you will win.
Oh and by the way, some people are worried saying that they signed a contract with the bank and agreed with the bank�s charges when they opened the account.
This makes no difference, what the banks have been doing is unlawful, they are only allowed to charge you the ACTUAL cost involved and it is unlawful to make any profit, that is why millions of �s are being refunded every week and obviously you will have seen the law firms willing to take cases up, the consumer watchdog, BBC, the newspapers, solicitors, Internet sites etc.
The contract becomes worthless when it is unlawful and this is why the banks are refunding.
They could put any amount on the leaflets �2000.00 if they wanted to, it does not make it lawful, It�s like somebody saying to you that they are going to run you over in their car, and then they do it, it does not mean it�s ok because they told you before they did it.
The case for the banks is that there is no case, they have admitted to making 4.5 Billion profit and a huge chunk of that being made from penalty charges, which is deemed unlawful..
That is why they are refunding�.
Get your money back��.
Go to either
moneysavingexpert.com
watch the video on reclaiming bank charges
or goto
penaltycharges.co.uk
Good Luck
The Latest Tel Hotline For the refund of Abbey National bank Charges is
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As a holder of this plan I am concerned that the regular statements sent out for this plan fail to enable you to monitor how the investment is performing and are completely different from the stements promised in the product brochure (which would let you monitor the investment). I am very worried that this investment is going down the drain as there is no way of monitoring how it is doing. My concerns are summarised in the below letter sent on 14th May. I also sent a similar letter on 14th February and have receive no response whatever to either letters, which represents extremely poor service (I am also concerned it may be deliberate).
14.5.05
Ms Joyce Robertson, Operations Manager Retail Investments,
Abbey National House,
287 St Vincent Street,
Glasgow
G2 5NB
Dear Ms Robertson,
Re: Safety Plus Growth Issue 9
Plan nos. XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
I have not had any reply to my letter of 14.2.05, a copy of which I attach. As explained in my letter of 14.2.05 I do not believe that plan holders are being kept aware of the performance of the investment in the way promised by the brochure given to me before my wife and I purchased this investment. I enclose a copy of the relevant brochure page. As a result it is much more difficult, if not impossible, to determine whether this investment is performing well or badly.
The brochure states that �Each statement will show the total contribution to your final return up to that point� I enclose a copy of the actual statement received which does not show the contribution to the final return, it merely shows the share price at the time of the statement and the change in share price since the last statement. Another page of the statement shows the cash-in value which also fails to indicate performance.
If this letter is also ignored I will be seeking help from the regulator.
Yours sincerely,
YOU ARE VERY WELCOME TO CONTACT ME ABOUT THIS AS I AM LESS LIKELY TO BE IGNORED BY THE ABBEY NATIONAL IF WE JOIN FORCES. I HAVE RECENTLY COPIED ALL THE PAPERWORK TO THE ABBEY NATIONAL FORMAL COMPLAINTS PROCEDURE BUT HOLD OUT LITTLE HOPE BASED ON MY EXPERIENCE UP TO NOW AND EXPECT TO HAVE GO TO THE FINANCIAL OMBUDSMAN TO SORT THIS OUT.
15 April 2006
Dear Angrycustomers,
My wife and I are also investors in this Abbey National Safety product being rollover customers from Issue 2 to Issue 12. The investment rollover was in July 2003 and I started campaigning for clearer statements the same month to the same person (Joyce Robertson). I intensified my campaign after receiving my January 2004 statement which showed only the cash in value. I eventually received a quite nonsensical reply in March 2004 which said that these investments were not invested in actual shares and therefore did not warrant giving maturity performance information. Also Abbey did not want to confuse their customers! I rejected all this as pure nonsense but they just told me to take my complaint to the FOS.
And then in September we received a "mass mailing" from abbey prompted, they said, by "customer feedback" which included a "fact sheet" showing the payoff structure. It was then that we discovered that rollover customers had not received the crucial brochure which showed this information. The brochure we had received called Key Features did not give the payoff of the new Issue 12 so we had assumed it was the same as the old Issue 2 product. In fact Issue 12 is much worse than Issue 2 by nearly half. Of course it had been impossible to detect the new payoff structure from the new statements. I complained to Abbey but they accepted no responsibility. I persisted with my complaints until in July 2005 Abbey at last admitted that I and all the other rollover customers had not received the right brochure. In the meantime (March 2005) I complained to the FOS about the statements and the missing brochure, claiming I had been missold the investment and this had resulted in financial loss. The FOS refused to accept the statements complaint because more that 6 months had passed since Abbey's last letter on this subject. The FOS accepted the misselling complaint and eventually (February 2006) upheld it but would only recommend compensation based on my original money back plus interest at the Bank of England base rate plus 1%. I have rejected this and have started a Small Claims proceeding against Abbey. Their lawyers have submitted a quite absurd defence but in it they claim that I am the only customer to have complained about the statements. This is obviously untrue since you have also complained!
I would be pleased if you or anybody else who is struggling with Abbey regarding this Safety producct could contact me. My telephone number is 01244 660736.
Alright people get a grip. Banks are not charities they don't provide accounts out of the goodness of their hearts you should have your money in your account to pay your bills, if you don't then tough luck! Expect to get charged, i mean have you been walking around with your head up your ass your whole life. If you don't have the money expect to be penalised. End of story!
Re "Re: Useless Arogant Bunch Of Complete W***ers" posted by AnotherPeevedOffAbbeyBank at 12:57 06/03/06 ...
Hi there,
I work for a TV company that is making a new consumer programme about bad service and I am looking for people to share their bank stories. I would love to speak to you about your Abbey national experiences.
Re "bank charges" posted by sineadmcvey at 12:40 14/02/06 ...
Hi Sinead,
I would love to speak to you about your experience with Abbey National. I am working on a new consumer programme for the BBC and am looking for people to share their stories on banks.
Re "ABBEY NATIONAL SAFETY PLUS GROWTH PLAN" posted by angrycustomers at 20:52 10/06/05 ...
i also have a gripe with abbey the money grabbers!
recently i changed employers and unfortunatly there was a delay in my wages being paid on time for my direct debits. this cost me �130 in costs! so i called the bank and tried to explain to this guy what had happened he was ok with me and refunded 2 of the charges as a good will gesture.
i was happy with this as i knew this was the best offer i'd get.
now i was told by letter i'd be told 2 week's prior to abbey taking this money.
well as quite a few people have said already no they did not!
now the fact my charges were given is i'd say is my employers fault.
now for my next gripe relating to this!
i cancelled all my d/d's and waited till the saturday to pay the companies over the phone with my visa electron as i was paid on the friday.
MONDAY MORNING!!!! letter saying visa payment to british telecom car insurance tv liscence and some other's unpaid!!!!!!!!!!!!
i was livid as i knew the funds were there! .
i called the bank to be put on to some guy in india who wouldnt press the silence button on his phone as he did behind the scene checks on his comp so i could hear him munching on a somosa or something which pissed me right off his heavy breathing ect....
after he came back on saying yes mr brock (my name is mr BROOKS!) he said u didnt have money there for transactions! anyway it went on for 10 minuites or so me telling him i did ect....
by now i was ready to launch my phone so i hung up and called some 1 else on this matter. my god the guy was english thank god immediatly he said we are very sorry our fault ignore the letters they were sent by computer.
phew!
maybe i should charge abbey �35 for each item they wrongly acused me of eh!
ok im vented now.
Re "Re: Useless Arogant Bunch Of Complete W***ers" posted by gruppe8 at 13:31 25/08/05 ...
(Re "Re: Useless Arogant Bunch Of Complete W***ers" posted by tregembo1 at 11:01 25/08/05 ...
reading all of your post there is blame and its with you, you could have covered yourself fully before leaving the country.....you did not....there must have been doubt in your mind when you was abroad otherwise you would not have been trying to transfer money over.......as for the banking ombusdman......unless the bank has made a error they will not do anything, the bank has done nothing wrong you have failed to have enough money in your account to cover direct debits...thats not the banks fault is it.....if you, like you say are going to go to another bank, and you make the same error apart from the call centre being in england you will get the same charges.....its as simple as that. )
Dear gruppe8, Your responce to tregembo1, is at best 'offensive', and at worst 'quite derisory' -and that is me 'being quite nice'!!
What I myself do really feel right now is that either you 'work for said bank' or walk around with 'cotton wool' within BOTH of your ears, have a 'Full Face Blindfold Fitted', and to be 'absolutely sure' that you hear, and see nothing of 'the real world', you are 'walking around' with your head stuffed up your own butt!!!
The Abbey Bank DO NOT CARE 'one hapeth, NOT one hapeth' for ANY Customer whom is not 'throwing money' in great wads there way, like or like not -fact that is!! They as a bank certainly Do Not Care for 'the majority of people' -those alike myself whom have 'fixed income', those of us that are 'not perfect', and or those they seem to see as being 'that of a burden' -like or like not, but that IS fact!!
I can personally 'emphersise' with Each, and Every person whom has posted their 'quite justified complaints' re the 'attitude, smugness, and greed, yes the greed' of The Abbey Bank, from my own 'personal experiances!! How can that bank 'justify' screwing me, you, all of us over for bank charges of �35.00 Per Line Entry, THEN a Further �33.00 Per Line Entry for 'unathorised card use', And Then FURTHER Bank Charges Per Month for being OD?? In my specific case THEY MADE ME OD, And Also Made Sure That I Was OD month, after month, after month, after month thereon -AND then 'charged me /cleaned me out, all for their pleasure!!!
I am alike many others to be totally self sufficient, with fixed income, I COULD 'explain more' but less to say, with my seeing thousands, yes thousands 'taken' from myself by way of 'unpaids, and bank charges, when in reality The Bank 'put me' into said position, That IS Not Right, Fair, or Justified at all, and to complain to receive back their 'holyier than thou attittude', 'their smugness', and 'their absolute lack of any form of care, or compassion' for me, you, and us 'their customer base', I find this to be quite intollerable.
You Sir, I believe to be quite wrong, to 'ram your high, and mighty attitude' down our throats, I alike many, many, many, many, many other 'abbey bank customers' are all ruing that day that we ever opened our abbey bank accounts -'the caring bank', and put our absolute faith, our total trust, and our own money within the reach of their abbey grabbing hands!! I alike many, many, many others seek to recover our own money BACK from that abbeymoneygrabbingbank, I alike all others need real help /advise, and NOT that of 'smugness', or 'holyier than thou' type of attitudes!!
Re "Re: Useless Arogant Bunch Of Complete W***ers" posted by gruppe8 at 13:31 25/08/05 ...
(Re "Re: Useless Arogant Bunch Of Complete W***ers" posted by tregembo1 at 11:01 25/08/05 ...
reading all of your post there is blame and its with you, you could have covered yourself fully before leaving the country.....you did not....there must have been doubt in your mind when you was abroad otherwise you would not have been trying to transfer money over.......as for the banking ombusdman......unless the bank has made a error they will not do anything, the bank has done nothing wrong you have failed to have enough money in your account to cover direct debits...thats not the banks fault is it.....if you, like you say are going to go to another bank, and you make the same error apart from the call centre being in england you will get the same charges.....its as simple as that. )
Dear gruppe8, Your responce to tregembo1, is at best 'offensive', and at worst 'quite derisory' -and that is me 'being quite nice'!!
What I myself do really feel right now is that either you 'work for said bank' or walk around with 'cotton wool' within BOTH of your ears, have a 'Full Face Blindfold Fitted', and to be 'absolutely sure' that you hear, and see nothing of 'the real world', you are 'walking around' with your head stuffed up your own butt!!!
The Abbey Bank DO NOT CARE 'one hapeth, NOT one hapeth' for ANY Customer whom is not 'throwing money' in great wads there way, like or like not -fact that is!! They as a bank certainly Do Not Care for 'the majority of people' -those alike myself whom have 'fixed income', those of us that are 'not perfect', and or those they seem to see as being 'that of a burden' -like or like not, but that IS fact!!
I can personally 'emphersise' with Each, and Every person whom has posted their 'quite justified complaints' re the 'attitude, smugness, and greed, yes the greed' of The Abbey Bank, from my own 'personal experiances!! How can that bank 'justify' screwing me, you, all of us over for bank charges of �35.00 Per Line Entry, THEN a Further �33.00 Per Line Entry for 'unathorised card use', And Then FURTHER Bank Charges Per Month for being OD?? In my specific case THEY MADE ME OD, And Also Made Sure That I Was OD month, after month, after month, after month thereon -AND then 'charged me /cleaned me out, all for their pleasure!!!
I am alike many others to be totally self sufficient, with fixed income, I COULD 'explain more' but less to say, with my seeing thousands, yes thousands 'taken' from myself by way of 'unpaids, and bank charges, when in reality The Bank 'put me' into said position, That IS Not Right, Fair, or Justified at all, and to complain to receive back their 'holyier than thou attittude', 'their smugness', and 'their absolute lack of any form of care, or compassion' for me, you, and us 'their customer base', I find this to be quite intollerable.
You Sir, I believe to be quite wrong, to 'ram your high, and mighty attitude' down our throats, I alike many, many, many, many, many other 'abbey bank customers' are all ruing that day that we ever opened our abbey bank accounts -'the caring bank', and put our absolute faith, our total trust, and our own money within the reach of their abbey grabbing hands!! I alike many, many, many others seek to recover our own money BACK from that abbeymoneygrabbingbank, I alike all others need real help /advise, and NOT that of 'smugness', or 'holyier than thou' type of attitudes!!
Re "Re: GRABBEY NATIONAL BANK" posted by SIMONCARR at 19:38 24/02/06 ...
To all you out there i sympathise with you all re:The GRABBY NATIONAL I hvae also had
a real bad experience with them they really do not care about there customers as long as
they get there monies there the worst bank.
My experience of bad bankmanship from them was when I was away ill from work for
four months,my slaary was halved and I had a job rearranging my direct debits instead
of helping me the GREEDY GRABBY NATIONAL decides they want to cancel all my direct
debits and cut my overdraft,After much calls letters i managed to save my direct debits
they cut my overdraft and told me I had to pay back each month they were taking charges from my account which they stole and to top it all I get a letter from them the other day to say i no longer have an account with them they have stopped my direct debits my salary can reamin so they can deduct from it willy nilly i said no way i was
told i would be able to just get a basic account i told them where to get off a bank I have
been with for years told them my situation when I was experiencing problems they did
nothing to help I think its so sad,disgraceful that they think they can get away with bad
treatment of their customers people should boycott them or let it be known by complaining to the appropiate authorities.
ON THE 16/02/2006 I RECEIVED A FINAL WARNING LETTER FROM A DEBT COLLECTION COMPANY SAYING I HAD SEVEN DAYS TO PAY �274 OR I WOULD BE TAKEN TO COURT.I PHONED THE DEBT COLLECTION COMPANY AND THEY TOLD ME IT WAS RELATING TO THE GRABBEY NATIONAL BANK FROM 2002.I GOT IN TOUCH WITH THE GRABBY NATIONAL AFTER SPEAKING TO NUMEROUS DIFFERENT GRABBY STAFF I WAS EVENTUALLY TOLD IT WAS FROM 2002, I WENT 23 PENCE OVERDRAWN AND THE CHARGES HAD ARISEN FROM THEN.I HAVE NEVER RECEIVED ANY LETTERS ,PHONE CALLS OR ANY CONTACT FROM GRABBY ABOUT BEING OVERDRAWN UNTIL I RECEIVED THIS LETTER FROM THE DEBT COLLECTION AGENCY. I AM STILL FIGHTING THIS WHICH IS CAUSING ALOT OF STRESS I FORGOT I HAD AN ACCOUNT WITH GRABBEY I THOUGHT IT WAS A NIL BALANCE AS I HAVE NEVER USED THE BANK SINCE 2002 I DONT KNOW WHERE THE CASH CARD ARE IS AS I OPENED OTHER ACCOUNTS AND FORGOT ALL ABOUT MY GRABBY ACCOUNT.ANYONE WITH ANY HELP OR ADVICE PLEASE GET IN TOUCH OR POST MESSAGE AS IM NOT SURE WHAT TO DO NEXT.
I bank with the Abbey and a couple of others. Having a cheque to bank and needing the funds released quickly, i rang around the banks to see which one provided the service of quick clearance and was told by the abbey call centre (irrelevant where they were based) that they provided this service and that it cost �12. Off I went to the bank which banked the cheque and asked them the same, no problem.
Later that day the bank manager rang to tell me I had been misinformed - they did not provide this service as it had been withdrawn a couple of years ago, the cheque had been passed on and couldn't be taken back and wouldn't clear for 3 - 5 days.
The whole idea was to bank with whichever bank had this service as I had a family bereavement and needed funds to visit my family who lived 200 miles away.
The manager offered to withdraw �400 against the �3000 cheque but said there would be charges, but when they were incurred, to write and ask for a refund.
Which I did.
They didn't.
Next month they charged for the direct debit I missed due to insufficient funds, due to bank charges, due to misinformation.
They refused to take responsibility.
It took 8 weeks for them to tell me it was my own fault.
It wasn't!!!!!!!!
What does one do?
Guest
21:14 04/02/06
I HATE GRABBEY NATIONAL - I will NEVER bank the lottery winnings there if I ever won! I would NEVER recommend anyone to open an account with them
They STOLE �200 in CHARGES from my account
Because my PAY went in LATE I didnt know I only credited my mobile phone with small amounts 6 times and issued 1 cheque
Yet when I tried to explain the circumstance to 1 a branch manager and 2 the telephone banking The 2nd was a "non british" woman who tried to accuse me of swearing!!!
I TOLD HER TO PLAY THE TAPE BACK ha ha ( I Didnt swear )
and I am looking into SLANDER charge now cause I TAPED the call as well ha ha
The 1st (who has the authority) didnt do anything to help either
They are NOT helpful or UNDERSTANDING! and don't give a crap about your circumstances!
It seems that when your down GRABBEY NATIONAL want to stamp you down even more
If I was rich then I wouldnt have gone into the red therefore for them to STEAL the �200 from my account has caused me to NEARLY STARVE we don't know where to BORROW money from to EAT or TRAVEL to work
A Caring and thoughtful bank? My ARSE!
Thanks GRABBY NATIONAL -- PS I wont mention the case the sun newpaper reported about you on Friday 3rd February 2006
Re: shame the bank account is crap as is the serviceas th
Re "Re: shame the bank account is crap as is the serviceas th" posted by Guest at 12:26 31/01/06 ...
Have you recently been on the end of absolutely terrible customer service?
Have you been:
� Manipulated and pressurised by call centre staff?
� on the end of stroppy assistants in a designer clothes shop?
� had your summer holiday ruined?
Experienced awful service:
� in hospital?
� with your bank manager?
� in your local supermarket?
� in a restaurant?
And is it ruining your life?
We are making a new series for BBC1 about bad service and are looking for people to share their stories. Our customer service guru will challenge the bad service culprits on your behalf and work with you to make sure it never happens again.
We need you to share your stories. Please email [email protected] or phone 0117 985 8750.
Guest
12:26 31/01/06
Re: shame the bank account is crap as is the serviceas th
THEY ARE UP WITH NTL AND EBAY FOR THE AWARD OF MOST USELESS TOSSERS.
I'M OFF TO NATIONWIDE, THEY CANT BE AS BAD
Unfortunately my mother died in October. I am executor of her estate. She had two small savings accounts with Abbey. I sumitted the death certificate and then the probate grant. I went into a branch and was with them half an hour filling in more forms. This was on 21 December a month later. They have still not closed the account and released the funds to the estate. Their probate team claim they do not log mail so cannot say whether the paperwork was received from their branch, oh and a lot of people died at Christmas (so, they are a team for that purpose?!) and it normally takes 19 working days to process a claim. This is not insurance or a complicated policy - just two basic savings accounts. They have no idea of customer service. My question is, Abbey, if all the other insurance companies, banks and other companies can turn paperwork around in 2-10 days (not working ones either) why can't you! I am glad to see I am not the only one disgrunted with Abbey National.
in June this year I finally made the big step to move out of my home, after 5 years of living a seperate life to my ex. Found a nice house for my daughter and me in an ideal location and Ex and me were still on speaking terms. He agreed to pay me out for my share of the house and went to the bank to get the mortgage re-arranged in his name only, plus the money he needs to give me. All fine so far. The mortgage advisor at the Abbey was only available once a week, so the Ex made an appointment to see him. 1st app 2 weeks later. He went in and was given a form to fill in and come back 2 weeks later. Ummm, they couldn't have sent that form to him before, or given it to him, when he made the appointment ? Ok, not to worry, he filled in the form and made another appointment with his accountant to get 3 years accounts (he is self-employed). He turned up at his next app with the Mortgage Advisor, had the form and 3 years accounts with him. The MA took the form, checked the accounts and said fine, all is well, and he will get the ball rolling. He asked us both to get solicitors (they wouldn't accept us using the same one), and asked us to get in touch with the Housing Association (the house is a shared-ownership home). We talked to the HA, which sent us back to the bank, who told us to speak to the solicitor, which in turn sent us back to the bank. Finally having had enough after 2 weeks run-around and copious days taken off work, I called the mortgage department at the bank. They gave me all the needed info and we went back to the mortgage advisor. We had a contact at the HA and the names of the solicitors. He said the whole process would take 3 months from there. Umm Excuse me ? 3 months ? Are you mad ? I was struggling to pay my bills by then, and really needed the money. That was August. He promised to speed things up. I went away or 2 weeks to stay with my parents, had to take out another loan for that, but Mr Mortgage Advisor told me he can speed things up, and it should only be 2 weeks now until we get the money. I came back from holiday, but nothin had happened on the mortgage front.
I called the mortgage department again, but they said he hadn't even sent in the application yet... we were now in September. I was really busy at work and couldn't keep calling him. Finally made contact at the end of September. He said he needed a letter from the HA that they agree to release me, and that we need to organize that. So I spent the next 2 weeks, trying to get that organized. Finally had a contact name for him (they said they need a letter from him, saying that the mortgage is agreed). He took 2 weeks to send that to them, by which time the person I was in touch with had left the company, and they couldn't find the letter anywhere (basically meaning he never sent it, as her manager was taking all her post, and he didn't see it). I was no talking to the manager at the HA and he said a fax will do them and they will fax their agreement back to the bank in return. So I asked the MA to fax it. Next day he confirmed that he now had everything he needed and that he will send everything off to the mortgage department. That was 29/10.He asked the EX to come in to sign a bunch of forms the next day and he said we would have the mortgage offer within a week, and then the money could be released 3 days later. Cool, I called around all the utility companies, paid my phone bill with the last money on my credit card, and sat back. Nothing.... still nothing..... called him again after 2 weeks. He said it should be with us any day, but to call him if we haven't got it that Friday. I had no f**** money at all by then. Not even enough to buy food.
The Ex lent me some (more debts). Obviously by Friday, still no letter. Called him on the Monday, and he said he asked the accountants for something he needed ( I was at work at the time, and didn't quite hear what it was, something about a reference), and hadn't had that back yet, and to call him again on Friday. Called him on Friday. He said he asked the accountants for the Ex's accounts, as he needed them for the application. I questioned why he told us 3 weeks earlier that everything was in order ? He said he thought he didn't need them. I called the EX, who confirmed that he had already given him the accounts, and that he has a copy sitting at home. So I called him back and called his bluff.... he said that he lost them, and was waiting for the accountants to send them to him again. In December ????? Does he know, how busy they are in december ? While he knew, that we had the stuff sitting at home ???? And I also asked him, why, when he asked the Ex to come in to fill out forms, he was trying to sell him un-employment insurance (the ex is self-employed and can't claim on it). He said it was just a standard set. I went in the next day to hand in a copy of the accounts and happened to meet his manager. So I asked her to make sure that this was sent off the next day, and mentioned that he had lost them before, and I don't want to hear anymore feeble excuses. She looked not too shocked at that, and said she would send them off herself, the same day. That was Saturday.
I called on Monday, to check, if everything was still on track, and was told he wasn't in the office that day. 10 mins later the Ex calls me. He said the MA was just on the phone to him, and said he refuses to take any more phone calls from me, as that is just "delaying things", and there is a problem with the accounts and that he thinks that the EX isn't earning enough to take over the mortgage by himself, and that there was no way now, that we would get the money before xmas, if we get it at all.
After 7 months of delaying things, lies and excuses he comes out with that ? Funny enough after I spoke to his manager, and basically threatening that he will delay, every time I call, and if the Ex hassles him, he will deny the mortgage and put that on his credit record. He now also says that we didn't start the application until the end of October (when my ex had to fill in another application form, as the MA had lost the original one which was filled in in June...). He is blackmailing us, while I have the bailiffs at the door, and he is whitewashin his back. And we got no proof of anything. He destroyed the only proof we had, when he "lost" the original application form, he denies everything, and he has an excuse for everything.....
Instead of having the first xmas with my daughter on my own, and starting a new life, my life is falling apart, I am getting myself deeper and deeper into debt, just to pay off the debt I got, I have bailiffs wanting me and he decides to sit back and do nothing. I can't afford a single present for her... I can't even afford food for the week.
I tried to get a bridging loan from the Abbey, so I can at least cut my bills, and find some feet back on the ground, but they refused, as by now my credit record is shot to pieces. They are the reson for it, but refuse to accept that and so I cannot re-finance. So I am stuck with a mortgage advisor who just sits there and doesn't give a damn.
On top of that, my Ex also has a current account with them. He is being charged 90pds overdraft fee nearly every month. Which would be acceptable....if there weren't 2000 pds sitting in the account..... He has to go to the branch every month, claiming it back.
My wife has been a customer for over 30 years, last year she opened one of these one year fixed term savings accounts where you make a regular payment monthly. The interest rate was very attractive 6.5% then 7%. We also got our 18-year-old daughter to set one up and she came with us to the branch to set them up together. It was clear from the reaction of the advisor in the branch that as this was a new account she was very unsure about how to open the account as I think she said this was the first she had opened and admitted they were giving no training! We went through the paperwork for both my wife and daughter, which took ages, and was told by the advisor (in error) that we could set-up, a standing orders to have the money coming out of another Abbey. We got a letter a week later saying the standing order was not valid so had to then arrange a standing order from another account. A month or so after we set ours up my 16-year-old son also set one up. A month later he got a letter from Abbey saying money had gone into the account at the wrong time and was against the rules of the account but they were prepared to not penalise him if he addressed the problem by a certain date. As our standing order matched his we also went into the branch and resolved the problem but queried why we had not also received a letter. The branch staff said not to worry if my wife put her's right also she would not be penalised. The interest was credited after the year and we could not work out how the interest was not at least double our daughters (she had saved �200 a month and we �500.) Went into another branch to query this and was told my wife's account had been set up a 'monthly saver' account rather than a 'fixed high interest' account, and was advised to go into the branch where we set the account up to query it. We decided to right to customer complaints instead and got a smug letter from them saying even IF what we are claiming is correct because one of our standing order payments went against the rules of the account we were not owed any more interest! When my son's year ended he received less interest than my daughter did even though they saved the same amount! The branch raised that query over 6 weeks ago! (we hope) and still not even a letter to say the problem is being investigated! Can anyone be sure they are getting the right interest on their account? It is only because we were able to compare interest we knew something was wrong. The bottom line here is we have lost faith in Abbey's ability to set-up and administer accounts, and in the event of a customer query you can expect a smug "are we were wrong but we have got you on a technicality" approach. Needless to say my wife's, my children's and my long association with Abbey is coming to an end so that is six less accounts for Abbey to worry about.
Just reading through all ur posts and i can see most of them are negative. Can i just say, i work in one of the personal banking call centres for Abbey and its a real shame that only the negative experiences seemed to get talked about as there are alot of good experiences that i hear of and deal with on a daily basis. As for the Indian call centres then everyone is entitled to their own opinion and as i am an abbey a/c holder myself i regularly use telephone banking and trust me some of the advisors are very good over there and get alot of attitude from callers, even people i work with that have a different accent get alot of abuse and they arent even in india. All i ask is that people remember they are human beings after all even though sometimes it may be difficult to keep this in mnd since its just a "voice"on the phone.
I opened an account in June, the switcher being an attraction. Nothing happened after the first month. I called Abbey 4 times to get this moving and I called my other bank, Barclays to cooporate with Abbey.
My last call to Abbey was in the middle of September. I basically told them that I was fed up with them. They sent me a letter at the end of september saying that they will get it done in the next 5 days, which did not happen.
The switcher manager said that it normally takes 28 days to do, and agreed that they have taken a long time to do this. So my question is why has it taken 3 months.... All this timewasting will cost me �1500 which Abbey does not want to take responsibility for.
You cannot seriously be asserting that it is right for overdraft penalties to be applied where a customer is the victim of a fraudulent cheque? Did you actually understand the post? this wasnt about someone overdrawing against an uncleared cheque, this was apparently a cheque that cleared in the normal way and time frame... and then the bank changed their mind some days later and "withdrew" the clearance
As bank customers we rely on the information we get from our bankers, if they say a cheque has cleared, then it is reasonable for the customer to believe that the transaction has been successfully concluded and withdraw the credit that exists at that point in his/her account. If at some later time the banks "change their mind" and withdraw the clearance from a cheque and place the "receiving" account in overdraft, it is hardly just or honest to penalise an innocent customer by hammering him/her with penalty charges (including the ludicrously expensive "correspondance" charges) for a situation that is not of the customers own making. Penalties should be applied to those who knowingly overdraw thier account, but NOT to people who may well be the victim of fraud.
At best, Under these circumstances the banks should HELP the customer to regularise the situation by arranging a medium term overdraft interest free that reduces over time to prevent hardship to the customer. Costs should be recovered from the fraudster where possible or absorbed by the bank when recovery is not available. Why should the banks be alowed to punish people for the actions of others? Please dont tell me that the few cases that this involves every year would be a crippling burden for the banks, they have quite enough spare cash to cover the tiny proportion of thier turnover that this would affect. If nothing else the bank should accept that the "receiving customer" is probably blameless and not apply extortionate charges to an account held by an "innocent" customer and allow him a reasonable time to reduce the overdraft.
That is hardly rocket science... and would be good customer relations, right now the banks seem hell bent on screwing the customer for as much as possible, even when the customer is an innocent victim, its bad enough being scammed with a bad cheque, without your bankers ripping you off as well.
HAVE YOU PAYED A CHEQUE INTO YOUR ABBEY ACCOUNT, AND HAD IT CLEARED WITHIN 3 TO 4 DAYS AND THE FUNDS PUT INTO YOUR ACCOUNT, THEN THEY BOUNCE THE CHEQUE 7 DAYS LATER AND REMOVE THE MONEY AGAIN?
This happend to me, i reported them to the ombudsman and after 11 months of investigation he told them to pay all they owed me with interest, and yes guess what they came up with some rubbish that they are now on the side of the bank based on probibilities. WHAT DOES THIS MEAN? i am at a loss and need to know if there is someone out there who has had the same experience, thier accounts are open to fraud, think about it !, you put in a cheque for say �10.000 from someone put it into your account, Abbey put money into your account without your say so or you signing anything showing the funds have cleared, you draw out the money, and they bounce the cheque. What if you hav'nt got the money for them to withdraw? they charge you for an illeagle overdraft, �30 per letter, interest on the amount, and a loan you did not want or ask for. How can this be legal? i need help please.
i think that you mean that a cheque is paid into a account it then shows as funds, you then draw out money and the cheque bounces...in this case you are drawing out money before the funds are clear.....and if a cheque is fraudulent it can be canceled several weeks after its been presented....the moral of this is that its not the banks fault....its not even your fault its the fault of the person that has presented you with a dodgy or fraudulent cheque...and of course you should take action against them to get the money pls any costs incurred.....to say its the banks fault is laughable..........to prove this would a bank actually bounce a cheque for no reason....they are a bank they want the money.......if there are sufficient funds in your account you will incur charges......its not rocket science
you put in a cheque for say �10.000 from someone put it into your account, .
So did you pay in a cheque? Or did abbey put money into your account that wasn't suppose to be there?
Quote:
Abbey put money into your account without your say so or you signing anything
It sound like your saying you paid a cheque in abbey cleared it, then took the money back for some reason. If that the case then you presenting the cheque is "you saying so". If it isn't the case then did they put the money by mistake.
HAVE YOU PAYED A CHEQUE INTO YOUR ABBEY ACCOUNT, AND HAD IT CLEARED WITHIN 3 TO 4 DAYS AND THE FUNDS PUT INTO YOUR ACCOUNT, THEN THEY BOUNCE THE CHEQUE 7 DAYS LATER AND REMOVE THE MONEY AGAIN?
This happend to me, i reported them to the ombudsman and after 11 months of investigation he told them to pay all they owed me with interest, and yes guess what they came up with some rubbish that they are now on the side of the bank based on probibilities. WHAT DOES THIS MEAN? i am at a loss and need to know if there is someone out there who has had the same experience, thier accounts are open to fraud, think about it !, you put in a cheque for say �10.000 from someone put it into your account, Abbey put money into your account without your say so or you signing anything showing the funds have cleared, you draw out the money, and they bounce the cheque. What if you hav'nt got the money for them to withdraw? they charge you for an illeagle overdraft, �30 per letter, interest on the amount, and a loan you did not want or ask for. How can this be legal? i need help please.
Re "Re: Useless Arogant Bunch Of Complete W***ers" posted by gruppe8 at 13:31 25/08/05 ...
I hate to agree with gruppe8, as we normally don't but he is totally right the standard charge is around �25-�30 depending on the bank. They charge you this each time they reject a d/d for insufficent funds. Also they will then charge you interest on the amount your over your agreed limit.
In each of your cases the amount seems alot even at �30 ago but the more d/d you have the more chance there is of it happening.
One little trick and it worked for me when LloydsTSB wanted to charge me similar amounts, is to mention that you'll be wanting to switch off their other services. Credit cards, loans... etc end of the day they do want to keep you as a customer, even if it doesn't seem like it.
One last point the poster that was abroad, set up internet banking. No problems then.
and as someone that never agrees with spook, i have to say he is correct, i have had a credit card for years, i was late with a payment once ecause i sent a cheque of later got slapped with a fee, but got it removed because ( a ) i had the card for years and always paid on time and ( b ) a veiled mention of cutting it up and going with a rival company. if you use abusive language to a bank you will get nothing done, its the same in any service industry, the peope that abuse staff never get any change out of ther situation
Re "Re: Useless Arogant Bunch Of Complete W***ers" posted by gruppe8 at 13:31 25/08/05 ...
I hate to agree with gruppe8, as we normally don't but he is totally right the standard charge is around �25-�30 depending on the bank. They charge you this each time they reject a d/d for insufficent funds. Also they will then charge you interest on the amount your over your agreed limit.
In each of your cases the amount seems alot even at �30 ago but the more d/d you have the more chance there is of it happening.
One little trick and it worked for me when LloydsTSB wanted to charge me similar amounts, is to mention that you'll be wanting to switch off their other services. Credit cards, loans... etc end of the day they do want to keep you as a customer, even if it doesn't seem like it.
One last point the poster that was abroad, set up internet banking. No problems then.
Re "Re: Useless Arogant Bunch Of Complete W***ers" posted by tregembo1 at 11:01 25/08/05 ...
reading all of your post there is blame and its with you, you could have covered yourself fully before leaving the country.....you did not....there must have been doubt in your mind when you was abroad otherwise you would not have been trying to transfer money over.......as for the banking ombusdman......unless the bank has made a error they will not do anything, the bank has done nothing wrong you have failed to have enough money in your account to cover direct debits...thats not the banks fault is it.....if you, like you say are going to go to another bank, and you make the same error apart from the call centre being in england you will get the same charges.....its as simple as that.
Re "Useless Arogant Bunch Of Complete W***ers" posted by moonshine at 21:39 24/08/05 ...
Abbey is just one greedy bank!! I recently had a simular problem with the Abbey. I was away in Newyork in June of this year visiting friends, i was aware that my direct debts were due to come out at the end of the month. I increased my over draft before i left for NY assuming that the increased amount would cover my account for the period i was away. However when i was in NY i tried to contact the Abbey to check my balance and transfer money from another account (also with the Abbey) if need be, no joy!! cant contact the Abbey on the 08459 724 724 number from the States!!. The number just isnt recordnised. When i got home and checked my account i realised that it had gone over drawn, and that 8 direct debits were not paid for. The Abbey then charged me �244 for my mistake, which was debited from my account in one lump sum. Very concerned i contacted the Abbey, to explain what had happened, expecting to be told that the problem could be resolved. The 1st insult came when i rang the Abbey only to be put through to one of their call centres in India !. The Girl i spoke to was useless, she could offer no help what so ever. I then asked to speak to a manager, (also in India) i was told that the manager was very busy dealing with other complaints, but he would ring me back in 48 hours !!. Only after insisting several times, did i get to speak to the manager. Again the same thing, all i was offered was a refund of �30, which i refused. The Abbey then wrote to me telling me that they had investigated the matter fully, and that their charges were in line with other banks and that they had made no error, and were not liable for the charges - just a sec isnt the Abbey supposed to be theer to look after me? after all they are using �2500 of my money every month!.They have told me that the case will be left open for 8 weeks after which time it will be closed. I have contacted the fiancial servives ombudsman, they have said i have a case to answer, they are currntly investigation the problem, i shall let you know how i get on. I recently opened an account with the Alliance and Leicester who DO NOT have call centres out side the UK. Once this problem is resolved i will be closing down all my accounts with Abbey, and shall be waving them fair well, with my middle finger!
I couldnt believe it I checked my bank account today to find that Abbey had debited �182.00 from my account in bank charges. I telephoned them to challenge this and surprise suprise I am put through to somebody that cant speak a word of English well as we would be able to understand and she said that I would have been notified by post that this was happening.... errr no I was not she then went on to say that it was charges for my account being overdrawn. When I ask? Realised that I was getting no where and asked to be put through to somebody higher.... excellent I thought someone I can understand..... yep I could grand but the attitude of the stuck up c*w was incredible she spoke to me as though I was a complete loser... ok I work for a firm of solicitors earning a rather comfortable salary. Anyway god I am seething...... it transpires that when you use your multi-function card to purchase items this amount does not automatically get debited straight from your account.... as the case used to be... in some cases it can take up to a month hence unfortunately there have not been the funds in the account then as it was not clear that this money had not come out when I carried out the transaction...... how can they do this and then have the cheek to charge you for it.... It is robbing innocent people blind to line the fat shareholders pockets. She gave me the impression that my charges were comparatively small by comparison to a lot of people.... I know they were making massive losses of late I wonder if this is now there way of recouping their losses.... I have been a loyal customer of Abbey for over 15 years and am marching in to see a bank manager tomorrow.... if the situation cannot be rectified I will be taking my banking elsewhere. Judging by other comments I have seen on this website they are slowly but surely making themselves very unpopular and bl**dy expensive! AN ANGRY AND DISGRUNTLED SOON TO BE EX CUSTOMER OF ABBEY
As a holder of this plan I am concerned that the regular statements sent out for this plan fail to enable you to monitor how the investment is performing and are completely different from the stements promised in the product brochure (which would let you monitor the investment). I am very worried that this investment is going down the drain as there is no way of monitoring how it is doing. My concerns are summarised in the below letter sent on 14th May. I also sent a similar letter on 14th February and have receive no response whatever to either letters, which represents extremely poor service (I am also concerned it may be deliberate).
14.5.05
Ms Joyce Robertson, Operations Manager Retail Investments,
Abbey National House,
287 St Vincent Street,
Glasgow
G2 5NB
Dear Ms Robertson,
Re: Safety Plus Growth Issue 9
Plan nos. XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
I have not had any reply to my letter of 14.2.05, a copy of which I attach. As explained in my letter of 14.2.05 I do not believe that plan holders are being kept aware of the performance of the investment in the way promised by the brochure given to me before my wife and I purchased this investment. I enclose a copy of the relevant brochure page. As a result it is much more difficult, if not impossible, to determine whether this investment is performing well or badly.
The brochure states that �Each statement will show the total contribution to your final return up to that point� I enclose a copy of the actual statement received which does not show the contribution to the final return, it merely shows the share price at the time of the statement and the change in share price since the last statement. Another page of the statement shows the cash-in value which also fails to indicate performance.
If this letter is also ignored I will be seeking help from the regulator.
Yours sincerely,
YOU ARE VERY WELCOME TO CONTACT ME ABOUT THIS AS I AM LESS LIKELY TO BE IGNORED BY THE ABBEY NATIONAL IF WE JOIN FORCES. I HAVE RECENTLY COPIED ALL THE PAPERWORK TO THE ABBEY NATIONAL FORMAL COMPLAINTS PROCEDURE BUT HOLD OUT LITTLE HOPE BASED ON MY EXPERIENCE UP TO NOW AND EXPECT TO HAVE GO TO THE FINANCIAL OMBUDSMAN TO SORT THIS OUT.
You are entitled to your opinon, but a customer base doesnt exist to provide employment on other continents, and I resent my financial affiars being used like some glorified job creation scheme, especially when time and time again I have problems with overseas call centres.
It isnt racist to say that a Customer services assistant that I cannot understand, or who doesnt understand me is of no use whatsoever. I dont think it is wrong for us to expect that companies who want the custom form people in a particular country to support the economy of that country by basing call centres locally to the customer base. Surely India etc have big enough populations to support thier ecomony internally servicing/maunufacturing for thier domestic market?
We dont manufacture... and now we are exporting the service industries (that replaced manufacturing) too.. we have a workforce too remember!
Last edited by warweezil on 11:37 25/08/05; edited 1 time in total
I called Abbey after it had taken them 6 months to transfer my mini cash ISA (they were offering the best rate and were overwhelmed by demand). I was asked to drop them a line stating what rate my money was on where it had been waiting � so they could reimburse the difference � all �26 of it.
When I got my annual statement at the end of the tax year it reminded me that I hadn�t heared from them. So, I made my irate phone call � during which the customer service staff told me that if I looked at my statement more closely there is �a very generous adjustment� of �286.21 on it.
A mistake with the decimal place or a big thank you? The staff suggested that I was best not to ask any more questions. Bonza.
Please think again about snootyness towards call center staff in the developing world. This represents much needed revenue and if customers in the North are supportive and apply pressure for decent labour standards it is something the Global South very much needs. To deprive the developing world of this much needed income because they're not speaking received - or 'BBC' - English would be churlish. Or perhaps we could have a campaign against call centers in Wales or Scotland next?
My Tessa matured with Abbey last April, I am still waiting for them to put the money into the ISA I opened! It's been a year now, 15 letters, umpteen phone calls, 5 visits to the branch. The money has been sitting in a very low interest account, just as soon (ha!) as it is sorted and they have back dated the interest, I'm out of there! (I have 3 other accounts with them).
I refuse to use the overseas call centre due to the operator not understanding English and i also don�t like the idea of making English unemployed to employee cheap labour aboard.
Instead I use the Lost and stolen selection on telephone banking as that is based in the UK (I wonder why). On being challenged on why I was using the lost and stolen for general banking I pointed out the above, and the wonderful lady replied that I was a racist.
This prompted me to make a compliant to Abbey about this, and pointing out the fact that
1) My wife is African
2) I spent several years working in 3rd world countries e.g. Africa
How dare they call me a racist who the hell do they think they are.
The response from abbey was a case of wine a big grovelling letter. I am currently in the process of moving bank.
One word of advice everyone who is with Abbey use the lost and stolen and that will soon change their approach. I have been with abbey for 20 years!!!
We booked to see a mortgage advisor in the branch.
Borrowing on a property purchase in spain.
No problems going on our wages, outgoings and current mortgage with them in the UK.
"Go and find the property then come back to us" said the advisor, it wont be a problem doing a buy to let on the balance you need.
Off we go....find a property, fall in love with it. Come back and make an appointment with the advisor to get the ball rolling only to be told we had been given the wrong advice and that they couldnt help on overseas purchases!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ive just wasted �400 and a week off work and may lose the property.
Abbey national Have realy helped out in th UK.. We have enough unemployment as it is and they add to it by moving the whole telephone banking system to INDIA..... OK its good that they are helping a growing country but hold on should I not say exploiting... In the uk they would have to pay around � 300 per week for each member of staff in india tthet are probably paying that per month..
Also it would realy help if the person answering the call can actualy speak the queens english. I could bearly understand what the lady was saying and she could not understand me...
It would have been nice if they asked the customers first about this change. I am now looking for a bank that has its telephone banking service based in the UK and will keep it there ...Perhaps I should open an account in India so when they open a telephone service in the UK the call will be taken there..
Abbey National. What a pile of s**t. They make 3000 of th
Abbey National. What a pile of s**t. They make 3000 of their staff redundant and then harp on about how they are turning banking on its head. Bollocks. They had the stuffing knocked out of em when they made a loss of 2 billion pounds last year. Now they are going back to their roots, a building Society. To be honest, they should never have expanded in the first place. One word sums them up. INCOMPETENT
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