I am also having "issues" with 1&1. i cancelled my account with them and ceased to use it. They however did not cancell it at their end and continued to charge me for it, be sending emails to the domain I was no longer using. Clever. I therefore was unaware, did not pay and they have now passed me on to a collections agency. Luckily they (debt agency) have been good enough to put a hold on the debt until thecomplaint has been resolved. I have requested 1&1 to pass my complaint onto their Director of Complaints/Customer Services, so far they have tried to dodge this.
I will let you know what happens, so far nothing but passing the buck.
At 9:59 14/08/08, ezdub wrote:
I am setting up a new forum to deal with 1and1 complaints.
I am hoping people will share their stories and offer help where they can.
I like many others have had bad service with this company and their complaints department.
I hope you will come by. This is a free service with no advertising so no money will be made from the forum the cost come from my own pocket.
I am just trying to get as many stories as possible to try and alter this companies poor running.
Hi, I have also had problems with these, and after reading what you have been saying over the past few years, I sent the following e-mail...
To Whom it may concern.
>
> Having received a bill for an outstanding account (See above Ref)
earlier on this year, I followed your cancellation procedure online and
confirmed my cancellation by letter sent to your Slough address, and
incorrectly thought that it was dealt with.
> Clearly this is not the case, as today I have received a demand from a
finance company requesting an annual fee (for a cancelled account) plus
late payment charges.
> As I am no longer in need of this domain name, please feel free to
keep it locked.
> You will not, however, be receiving a penny more than my original
payment.
>
> I tried to explain this to one of your telephone customer service
handlers, who told me I could e-mail my complaint. When I asked her if I
could speak to someone in charge she refused to hand me over. She
sounded well and truly fed up with being there, and I imagine I was not
the first to be fobbed off in this way. Clearly there is something dodgy
going on when you cannot voice a complaint to a person....obviously they
are far to busy dealing with your MANY unhappy customers to be able to
answer calls. So here is my complaint.
>
> I do not want your company to host this domain for me. I neither need
it nor want it now. I cancelled it following your online procedures and
backed it up with a letter months ago. It is now down to your own
incompetence that you still have this account up and running, therefore,
it is up to you to write off this outstanding amount.
>
> Please can you confirm that this amount is no longer outstanding, and
inform your finance company that they do not need to pursue this
invoice.
>
> Please do not send me any more demands for payment, they will not be
paid. Should I receive another letter requesting payment of a non
existing charge, I will be taking further action. This is not only
ridiculous, it is also illegal!
>
> Many thanks for (hopefully) taking the time to read this.
>
> Kind regards
I have since received confirmation that the account is terminated and I owe nothing.
I would just lke to say, thanks for giving me the courage to do this and I hope you all get it sorted without too much hassle.
Re "Re: 1 & 1 Internet" posted by Cervilan at 18:36 08/02/08 ...
Today after wasting months trying to resolve a number of issues with 1and1 I have now cracked and am taking it to the courts. They have robbed me of over �1100.00 they have cost me customers they have frozen an account that was paid up they have told me domain names were not available forcing me to open a new account elsewhere, they have locked an account, then emailed the locked account to tell me that I needed to reply with a given period in oreder to rectify the situation, how could I when the email was locked....the list goes on however a couple of months ago I had to take the pain and migrate around 160 domains to namesco, this exercise has cost me big time and after contacting trading standards (who carry a very large on 1and1 file at their Slough office), I have decided that the courts would be the quickest way to resolution.
Stunts to check out, you phone billing to find out why you have received a bill for �135 its for domains we have renewed for you.....but those domains are not registered with you I told you that last week? hold please 20 mins later you've been put through to some tech guy in India who tells you he cant help. You phone back 20 mins on hold speak to a person who tells you to email complaints you do and nothing happens in the meantime something else within the 1and1 empire falls over and locks a load of domains in a different account......it's crazy....I have sent faxes emails approx 30 hours on the phone over the last two years and nothing happens!!! I have even thought of driving to Slough and kicking off in their reception, thats how angry I am. As a company they are RUBBISH.
I cant charge back on the credit card we use as that would cause a bunch of other accounts under that card to close, I have heard that they have a habit of shutting everything down in the event of you getting near to the point of resolution ie. getting any back out of them....so watch this space.
Their billing Tel No. is 01753 490402, for gods sake dont use the 0845 no. Will keep you posted
Today after wasting months trying to resolve a number of issues with 1and1 I have now cracked and am taking it to the courts. They have robbed me of over �1100.00 they have cost me customers they have frozen an account that was paid up they have told me domain names were not available forcing me to open a new account elsewhere, they have locked an account, then emailed the locked account to tell me that I needed to reply with a given period in oreder to rectify the situation, how could I when the email was locked....the list goes on however a couple of months ago I had to take the pain and migrate around 160 domains to namesco, this exercise has cost me big time and after contacting trading standards (who carry a very large on 1and1 file at their Slough office), I have decided that the courts would be the quickest way to resolution.
Stunts to check out, you phone billing to find out why you have received a bill for �135 its for domains we have renewed for you.....but those domains are not registered with you I told you that last week? hold please 20 mins later you've been put through to some tech guy in India who tells you he cant help. You phone back 20 mins on hold speak to a person who tells you to email complaints you do and nothing happens in the meantime something else within the 1and1 empire falls over and locks a load of domains in a different account......it's crazy....I have sent faxes emails approx 30 hours on the phone over the last two years and nothing happens!!! I have even thought of driving to Slough and kicking off in their reception, thats how angry I am. As a company they are RUBBISH.
I cant charge back on the credit card we use as that would cause a bunch of other accounts under that card to close, I have heard that they have a habit of shutting everything down in the event of you getting near to the point of resolution ie. getting any back out of them....so watch this space.
Their billing Tel No. is 01753 490402, for gods sake dont use the 0845 no. Will keep you posted.
Re: 1&1 - my fraud complaint allegation to Thames Valley
A great way of stopping people from illegally taking money from your credit card is to report it as lost. That way the card will be stopped immediately and their flow of your money stops with it. No crime reference number to get, no disbelieving card issuers. You've lost it, period. They then have no option but to cancel it.
At 10:14 23/04/08, Ranchero wrote:
I have been stung on more than one occasion by 1&1 and the latest situation is to my mind clearly fraudulent. Taking money under clear false pretences and not doing anything about it is fraud.
If anyone has similar stories to tell, and it is clear that they do, you only have to google 1&1 and scam to see all the shocking tales, then please don't hesitate to take action.
I email Pete Davis the Superintendent for the Slough division of Thames Valley Police. Slough is where 1&1 are based in the UK. His email is either [email protected] or [email protected]
This is my complaint to him and my story.
I would like to make a complaint of fraud against a Slough company called 1&1 - a company that provides internet domain
names and provides web space to host websites with those names.
I have put this to you as the Local Police Area Commander for the Slough area.
The reason for the complaint is that 1&1 have taken money from my account under false pretences having had clear
instructions from me, which they have confirmed receipt of, stating that I no longer wanted their service having
previously had problems with the company taking money under false pretences.
I am a national newspaper journalist by trade who deals with consumer affairs, and I am aware that police don't always feel
these matters are cut and dried.
But I have clear evidence that I have written to the company on many occasions about the previous problems of taking money
from me over and above what they should have, and clear emails to the 1&1 CEO Andreas Gauger which I can provide and the
complaints department saying I wanted nothing more to do with them and that I wanted clear instructions on how to transfer,
without any down time to my website. A clean movement. This is was at the end of May, last year and the beginning of June.
I had only been with them for three months. They instituted the move of the domain so it they know all about.
Despite all that has gone before, on March 20, 2008 they billed me for a year's worth of service for �28.06 and state that
I had not cancelled. I would not have noticed this had I not scrutinised my credit card bill.
Further, there is a barrage of complaints about similar matters about this company on the internet, and it is clear that I
am not the only one to have suffered at the hands of these cowboys. A word you will encounter a lot. All you have to do is
put 1&1 and scam in the search engine and there are a host of complaints. Not just one or two. A barrage.
I wish I had read up on them before agreeing to join. Here are a few threads for starters...
http://www.grumbletext.co.uk/vt.php?t=1242&subj=complaints+1%26amp%3B1+Internet+Ltd+-+what+terrible+servce.+complaint
AND
http://www.grumbletext.co.uk/vt.php?t=1242&start=50&subj=complaints+1%26amp%3B1+Internet+Ltd+-+what+terrible+servce.+compla
int AND http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?t=582576 AND
http://www.chrisbeach.co.uk/view/tech/avoid_oneandone_internet
The list goes on.
They took money from me under false pretences. Nothing more and nothing less.
I have written to the company but got nowhere.
The problems began in May, last year after I signed up for 1&1's Beginner package. I moved a website I host to them in
March and got advice from 1&1 about the cost and there were no extras.
The package, as published stated as follows
1&1 Beginner : 250 MB web space;
20 POP3 Accounts; 8-page WebsiteBuilder 1.75 �/ month inc. VAT
Then I discovered on my first bill that they were charging me on top of this �0.99 for something called "per Gbyte" in
terms of traffic. At the time I had never heard of this. My efforts to get a response throughout were meant with silence,
unnecessary long periods without a response and I ended up having the write to the CEO of 1&1 Andreas Gauger who never ever
responded back.
I found out this extra charge that was never declared at the time was for the benefit of people visiting my webspace,
including me! The more popular the site, the more you pay, because every time someone visit's a page, they download that
page onto their computer, hence this Gbyte charge, as I found out later.
I told them I would never have gone to the bother of transferring if I knew of this ridiculous charge. My previous provider
did not have such a thing.
I then got an email from Joseph Quinn in Technical Support, refunding this charge to me.
I responded saying that there was a breach of trust in that the charge was not declared to me and that they had not
answered to this.
I was provided no terms and conditions and there was absolutely nothing on my online package or indeed anything declared in
phone conversations with 1&1 about this extra charge. I offered to send them the page which showed clearly that this charge
is not mentioned but they did not need this.
The charges themselves were also far from transparent.
I told them at the time that as these charges were never up front this was a corrupt way of doing business and wanted to
transfer to another provider.
As I said to them, if you go to buy a Mars bar you don't expect to be told after the fact that you have to pay more for the
chocolate coating.
I then got an email from Jordan Bernstein of technical support accepting that I was not familiar with the charge.
This is the background to which I decided on May 30 in an email sent to the complaints department and Andreas Gauger that I
wanted to move my custom elsewhere, causing much hassle to myself. It was clear this charge was remaining and further
emails asking for clarification were going unanswered.
In the email I made it clear I wanted to know in clear terms a step by step guide to move elsewhere "and an assurance that
it will not bring about any down time to my site, will not bring about the loss of the domain name, or cause any
disruption in any way, save the hassle to ME of having to administer this. This is the last straw as far as I am
concerned..."
Eventually after a lot of toing and froing and another invoice for this traffic, which had to contest again, I got
confirmation of cancellation by email on June 18.
There were no further charges until I found that they had billed me on March 20, this year for another year's worth of
having the webspace package, which I had clearly cancelled. After all, they had not given me any other bill since then.
Now I know that the previous problems are not as cut and dried as far as the police are concerned, but this latest charge
most definitely is.
There is no getting away from the fact I was an unhappy customer, they should have a big file on it and that I was
quitting.
Yet they have still found cause to charge me for a year. This only serves to underline the sharp practices that this
company operate under.
And they won't refund my money so I have had to institute chargeback proceedings through my credit card and of course
report the matter to yourselves.
I think the police have a public duty to look into how this Slough-based operation operates.
If you require any more information don't hesitate to contact me.
MW
1&1 - my fraud complaint allegation to Thames Valley Pol
I have been stung on more than one occasion by 1&1 and the latest situation is to my mind clearly fraudulent. Taking money under clear false pretences and not doing anything about it is fraud.
If anyone has similar stories to tell, and it is clear that they do, you only have to google 1&1 and scam to see all the shocking tales, then please don't hesitate to take action.
I email Pete Davis the Superintendent for the Slough division of Thames Valley Police. Slough is where 1&1 are based in the UK. His email is either [email protected] or [email protected]
This is my complaint to him and my story.
I would like to make a complaint of fraud against a Slough company called 1&1 - a company that provides internet domain
names and provides web space to host websites with those names.
I have put this to you as the Local Police Area Commander for the Slough area.
The reason for the complaint is that 1&1 have taken money from my account under false pretences having had clear
instructions from me, which they have confirmed receipt of, stating that I no longer wanted their service having
previously had problems with the company taking money under false pretences.
I am a national newspaper journalist by trade who deals with consumer affairs, and I am aware that police don't always feel
these matters are cut and dried.
But I have clear evidence that I have written to the company on many occasions about the previous problems of taking money
from me over and above what they should have, and clear emails to the 1&1 CEO Andreas Gauger which I can provide and the
complaints department saying I wanted nothing more to do with them and that I wanted clear instructions on how to transfer,
without any down time to my website. A clean movement. This is was at the end of May, last year and the beginning of June.
I had only been with them for three months. They instituted the move of the domain so it they know all about.
Despite all that has gone before, on March 20, 2008 they billed me for a year's worth of service for �28.06 and state that
I had not cancelled. I would not have noticed this had I not scrutinised my credit card bill.
Further, there is a barrage of complaints about similar matters about this company on the internet, and it is clear that I
am not the only one to have suffered at the hands of these cowboys. A word you will encounter a lot. All you have to do is
put 1&1 and scam in the search engine and there are a host of complaints. Not just one or two. A barrage.
I wish I had read up on them before agreeing to join. Here are a few threads for starters...
http://www.grumbletext.co.uk/vt.php?t=1242&subj=complaints+1%26amp%3B1+Internet+Ltd+-+what+terrible+servce.+complaint
AND
http://www.grumbletext.co.uk/vt.php?t=1242&start=50&subj=complaints+1%26amp%3B1+Internet+Ltd+-+what+terrible+servce.+compla
int AND http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showthread.php?t=582576 AND
http://www.chrisbeach.co.uk/view/tech/avoid_oneandone_internet
The list goes on.
They took money from me under false pretences. Nothing more and nothing less.
I have written to the company but got nowhere.
The problems began in May, last year after I signed up for 1&1's Beginner package. I moved a website I host to them in
March and got advice from 1&1 about the cost and there were no extras.
The package, as published stated as follows
1&1 Beginner : 250 MB web space;
20 POP3 Accounts; 8-page WebsiteBuilder 1.75 �/ month inc. VAT
Then I discovered on my first bill that they were charging me on top of this �0.99 for something called "per Gbyte" in
terms of traffic. At the time I had never heard of this. My efforts to get a response throughout were meant with silence,
unnecessary long periods without a response and I ended up having the write to the CEO of 1&1 Andreas Gauger who never ever
responded back.
I found out this extra charge that was never declared at the time was for the benefit of people visiting my webspace,
including me! The more popular the site, the more you pay, because every time someone visit's a page, they download that
page onto their computer, hence this Gbyte charge, as I found out later.
I told them I would never have gone to the bother of transferring if I knew of this ridiculous charge. My previous provider
did not have such a thing.
I then got an email from Joseph Quinn in Technical Support, refunding this charge to me.
I responded saying that there was a breach of trust in that the charge was not declared to me and that they had not
answered to this.
I was provided no terms and conditions and there was absolutely nothing on my online package or indeed anything declared in
phone conversations with 1&1 about this extra charge. I offered to send them the page which showed clearly that this charge
is not mentioned but they did not need this.
The charges themselves were also far from transparent.
I told them at the time that as these charges were never up front this was a corrupt way of doing business and wanted to
transfer to another provider.
As I said to them, if you go to buy a Mars bar you don't expect to be told after the fact that you have to pay more for the
chocolate coating.
I then got an email from Jordan Bernstein of technical support accepting that I was not familiar with the charge.
This is the background to which I decided on May 30 in an email sent to the complaints department and Andreas Gauger that I
wanted to move my custom elsewhere, causing much hassle to myself. It was clear this charge was remaining and further
emails asking for clarification were going unanswered.
In the email I made it clear I wanted to know in clear terms a step by step guide to move elsewhere "and an assurance that
it will not bring about any down time to my site, will not bring about the loss of the domain name, or cause any
disruption in any way, save the hassle to ME of having to administer this. This is the last straw as far as I am
concerned..."
Eventually after a lot of toing and froing and another invoice for this traffic, which had to contest again, I got
confirmation of cancellation by email on June 18.
There were no further charges until I found that they had billed me on March 20, this year for another year's worth of
having the webspace package, which I had clearly cancelled. After all, they had not given me any other bill since then.
Now I know that the previous problems are not as cut and dried as far as the police are concerned, but this latest charge
most definitely is.
There is no getting away from the fact I was an unhappy customer, they should have a big file on it and that I was
quitting.
Yet they have still found cause to charge me for a year. This only serves to underline the sharp practices that this
company operate under.
And they won't refund my money so I have had to institute chargeback proceedings through my credit card and of course
report the matter to yourselves.
I think the police have a public duty to look into how this Slough-based operation operates.
If you require any more information don't hesitate to contact me.
MW
Re "Re: 1 & 1 Internet" posted by monkey at 11:16 12/02/08 ...
Having the same issues as mentioed here by many people. Just received a email back from 1 &1 stating that at the time I took out my subscription, that there is a Payment Terms note saying that renewal is automatic. Checked this and it's is there, just as they say. Can't say I remember this, not that it makes a difference ( see below on T&Cs). Like others I was supprised to get a demand as I had not used any of the sites I'd bought, and having had sites previously from other sellers, when the subscription expired and I did not renew they just cancelled the web sites.
The bottom line however, as I see this, is the Payment Term is not actually detailed as part of their T&C's, which is the legally binging part of any contract.
On a pervious note going back a couple of years I noticed a very detailed note on just this. What I would ask, is what experience or actions has anyone had by not paying, having detailed to 1&1 and their debt collectors, that the action to collect these 'debts' is not legal, as the dept is not 'real', again as I see it and as others here have expressed.
Re "Re: 1 & 1 Internet" posted by CCW at 22:30 11/02/08 ...
Interesting to do a Google advanced search for all of the words 1and1 hate
(or 1&1 hate). It's amazing what sites it leads you to.
I also have just received a letter from arvato advising a debt of �14.36 in relation to 2 domain names I thought had long expired. I've now cancelled both contracts. The cancellation process was a mess. I replied to both cancellation emails asking if I needed to send a fax and asking how to send a fax when I don't have access to a fax machine. One reply said there was no need to send a fax. The other reply told me to go to an internet cafe with a fax machine. When I challenged this I received a reply saying there was no need to send a fax. The reply also quoted section 4.4 of the terms and conditions which allows the company to renew domain names. I'm not sure whether to pay up and put it down to experience!
Because of my current problem with 1&1, I've spent a lot of time (too much!) reading reviews and opinions. They are a very successful company, now internationally so, but reading the American sites it is clear that the complaints are similar to the UK ones, in other words it's a matter of company policy and not just a question of staff competence. They offer a cheap service which I believe is generally good at doing what it is supposed to do.
What they do not offer is any worthwhile support if you have problems. Obstacles are put in your way if you want to leave, and without any human intervention the debt collectors will be in touch. It's automatic !
A quick search soon reveals many complaints, one of my favourites is at
www.simonjones.info/1and1internet But it's easy to find hundreds of similar ones.
A company of this size will certainly have it's own lawyers, and if you want to take serious action against it, you can expect a tough response.
My advice: avoid 1and1, their policies are a total disgrace.
I agree - they are obviously a total disgrace. Someone at Harvard Business School published some research about three years ago as I recall that said the nastiest companies are the ones that do best. I think they pursue that policy for that reason. I would like to think it isn't true but as we all know, the biggest brutes are the ones that dominate in this world. However, as we have seen with a number of companies over the last few years they can also fall very hard when their time comes and in real terms 1&1 is not actually very big. I have been in business in my own right this year for 30 years and inevitably over 30 years you fall out with suppliers and customers quite a few times and you end up in court quite a few times as well. My experience of lawyers is that most of them are not very good, possibly because they take on too much and don't pay attention to the small details. Consequently I have been doing my own court work for years and I have won every time. County Court procedure is now very easy and I would advise anyone who has a bit of nouse to do it themselves. The judges these days are generally very patient if you act sensibly and prepare your case properly. In this instance I counsulted a solicitor just as a precaution. Their advice was that 1&1 have extensive Conditions of Sale that you could spend days arguing over. This is a typical sort of American corporate approach - produce lots of smoke and confusion. It doesn't mean however that they would win because a lot of those conditions seem unreasonable to me and in my case they don't actually cover what happened. Nevertheless - the bottom line is: Don't go near them if your started your business to make money. They will waste your time and your time is money. Go somewhere else.
Because of my current problem with 1&1, I've spent a lot of time (too much!) reading reviews and opinions. They are a very successful company, now internationally so, but reading the American sites it is clear that the complaints are similar to the UK ones, in other words it's a matter of company policy and not just a question of staff competence. They offer a cheap service which I believe is generally good at doing what it is supposed to do.
What they do not offer is any worthwhile support if you have problems. Obstacles are put in your way if you want to leave, and without any human intervention the debt collectors will be in touch. It's automatic !
A quick search soon reveals many complaints, one of my favourites is at
www.simonjones.info/1and1internet But it's easy to find hundreds of similar ones.
A company of this size will certainly have it's own lawyers, and if you want to take serious action against it, you can expect a tough response.
My advice: avoid 1and1, their policies are a total disgrace.
It seems that 1&1 are still at it in exactly the same way. BFS are now known as Arvato Finance, and at the moment I'm at part two of their correspondence and heading towards Smiths Solicitors. I would be worried, but the posts on this forum have given me the confidence to carry on refusing their silly demands.
Thank you everybody !
I am pleased to see another posting after such a long gap. I am a professional web designer and last year 1&1 switched off the server I was leasing from them after it was hacked. Shortly afterwards Fasthosts was hacked in a big way and I am now convinced that 1 & 1 should have taken responsibility and supported me. As it was they dumped me and I 'lost' about 40 client websites. The sites were backed up of course but it was a major major problem and even today - almost a year later - I am still clearing up the mess. I now reckon that they cost me about four months work - yes that's �40,000 in real money and don't I know it, with a teenager in a top public school that costs almost �30,000 a year it has really f***ed me and my family up big time. After months trying to understand why they acted in such an unbusinesslike manner ( I have since paid Fasthosts nearly �2,000 that would have gone to 1&1) I have come to the conclusion that being a German company they either have a bullheaded Teutonic downright stupid approach to business or alternatively they have people working for them that are just plain pig thick. I haven't even started to retaliate yet but I've commissioned the domain name that I'm going to do it from. Don't be scared of 1&1 they are plebs of the lowest order. Don't let debt collectors bully you. Without a County Court judgement they can do nothing. Keep all correspondence and have your day in court. It won't come to that of course because it isn't economical for them to do anything other than bully you in the knowledge that most people cave in. 1 & 1 can't be trusted. Keep away from them, they are a waste of space.
It seems that 1&1 are still at it in exactly the same way. BFS are now known as Arvato Finance, and at the moment I'm at part two of their correspondence and heading towards Smiths Solicitors. I would be worried, but the posts on this forum have given me the confidence to carry on refusing their silly demands.
Thank you everybody !
What surprises me is that this forum has petered out - watch this space !
At 16:35 24/10/05, Teens wrote:
Re "1 & 1 Internet" posted by coleisgre at 12:37 21/10/05 ...
DITTO... DITTO... DITTO...
1&1 failed to take my authorised payment for their service... passed my details on to BFS Finance... and guess what? After I agreed to pay the increased costs to get them off my back (how dumb was that?!) by providing a cheque for full payment - BFS have now failed to cash the cheque!! Instead I've received another letter - this time from a debt agency called Smiths... who funnily enough trade out of the same Marylebone address as BFS! My alleged 'debt' has now risen from �10 to �105... and NO WAY am I paying it! I've contacted Westminster Trading Standards (in respect to BFS/Smiths) and BBC Watchdog to tell them the whole story. I am also passing 1&1's details to Slough Trading Standards. Suggest everyone else does the same... and get these t*ssers their just desserts ASAP!
My first dedicated server from 1and1.co.uk I order last year � I was waiting 20 days they deliver it in January this yare for next one I wait over 30 days � same for the third one �
I signed for 100Mbit unmettered servers � after 07.03.2006 1&1.co.uk change the rules back in time and start limiting my servers (during first days no one can answer my questions I have seen the limits but no one from support like to help me wit this problem)
So I try to ask how to cancel the contract and up to today 1&1 is trying to charge me for servers�
One of them is down over week time (I report it they done nothing :/)
With other one they were playing few days (no good :/)
That�s why I decided to cancel the contract all story I describe in letter which you can download from
Please if you can help me with this problem send me an emails or post here - i try to cancel the contract but 1and1 is not answering my emails, letters (Royal Mail) phone call
is usualy without the answer they can do nothing ...
Thank you for your help�.
P.S. Don�t believe the incompetent thieves 1and1.co.uk is WORST server supplier which you can find.
1and1 - BFS FINANCE WRITE OFF DEBT. RESULT AT LAST
Ive just received an email from 1and1 letting me know that my debt has now being wrote off.
I sent them a final letter, via recorded delivery including all my previous letters I had sent to them and emails I had sent them I also included photocopies of BFS demands and sent the same to BFS recorded delivery.
I mentioned how I had being in touch with Citizens Advice who were extremely keen for me to keep them informed of BFS & 1and1s next move after sending them my final letter, as Citizens advice had contacted my local trading standards and were itching to find out what 1and1 or BFS came back to me with this time, I also let them know that I had taken legal advice and would be starting court proceedings against them both (1and1 & BFS) if they continued on trying to claim for money which they simply were not entitled to no matter what their unfair and ridiculous terms n conditions state.
Of course they could not let it go without stating that it was upto me to contact 1and1 if after 14 days I had not being notified in the 1st place that my account had being closed last year, bit strange since I had sent them numerous emails and letters and phone calls etc etc.
DONT GIVE IN
ITS YOUR MONEY
NOT THEIRS
DONT FORGET
THE SMALL CLAIMS COURT only costs you �30 and you DO NOT have to pay the other parties legal/court costs etc if you loose (not that you would or could loose).
Re "Can the actions of 1&1 be classed as fraud ?" posted by iceman89 at 0:48 13/10/05 ...
I have also had problems with 1and1, not only that their terms and conditions are unfair, but they alos illegally suspend contratcs that are paid for in full and in advance-
I had more than one account with 1and1, and after not paying for a domain I cancelled they decided to suspend my other accounts that had no outstanding payments.
Their business practice is disgusting.
With regards to them demanding you fax a cancellation I pointed out to them that having access to a printer and fax machine is not in their signup terms.
I just filed an FTC complaint against 1and1. I hope all US based customers do the same. This is what I wrote since the FTC online complaint form only allows 2000 characters:
Problem: (Please limit your complaint to 2000 characters.): (Product Name: domain registration) This company uses very unscrupulous tactics to prevent users from cancelling their services. The first time I attempted to cancel my services with them was in April 2005. I contacted them and said I wanted to cancel any further renewals of my domains. I got a confirmation from a rep named Erika Allen that the account was cancelled. However, in December 2005 they charged my credit card for the account that I thought was cancelled. So I cancelled my credit card and attempted to cancel my account again. This time on 12/22/05 they confirmed that my account was once again cancelled. To my surprise on 01/26/2006 they attempted to charge my already cancelled credit card again and ofcourse they did not get any money. I contacted them again about this and they said that my account was still active with them and I am responsible for the charges. But the fact is that they already deleted my account and I have no access to the services that I did not order. They have threatened to send my account to a collection agency and tacked on another $20 supposed "service charge". I then searched on the internet to see if other users of 1and1 had similar experiences and it seems that many of them have experienced the same thing, 1and1 lies to them about their account being cancelled, and then charges them again. I really would like the FTC to investigate this unscrupulous company. Thank you very much.
Re "Re: Aren't there laws against this??!" posted by Guest at 15:16 10/03/06 ...
Hi to everyone reading this huge huge collection of people who have being hit by this scam by 1and1 also known as oneandone and BFS also known as Bertelsmann Financial Services of germany.
All the cases below are all very very similar, Im in the same boat myself now being pursued for the huge huge sum of an initial �10 for 1 domain I forgot I actually had, until I noticed the money had being debited from my account in 2004 and now that nice German outfit BFS and their colleagues in the other half of the room, Smiths solicitors are treatening me with fees upto the grand total of �105 if I dont dig deep and pay the new price of �25 which includes their �15 collection fee, and of course they are threatening to have my credit rating adversly affected as well, whooooh Im shaking in my boots at the scare tactics to get me to throw in the towel and pay up.
If you read further down at other peoples experiances you will find that some people have indeed paid BFS only for BFS not to cash their cheque and continue chasing them for money.
Do I have an answer,
Yes its simple,
Grab all your documentation you have print it off, have your story of what has happened to you set out in your mind, then walk down to your local Citizens Advice Bureau and sit there for over an hour waiting impatiently as I did and watch the staff howl with laughter like they did with me at such a clean cut straight forward case of blatent bully boy tactics and scare tactics by BFS and OneandOne.
The CAB staff were absolutely astonded that I had even contemplated sending in a fax as the oneandone website now states (as apparently it changes from one month to the next as to which process they prefer you to use) even though I had rang up oneandone and being told in Dec 2004 that I needed to send a letter in canceling the contract when it was up for renewel in Nov 2005 giving 30 days notice as I had the letter that I had sent oneandone giving them actually 60 days notice along with 2 emails I had also sent them.
The CAB staff told me that the letter was more than suffice with the 2 emails as I had put at the end of the cancellation letter and emails to OneandOne :
"This letter is to give you more than your standard requirement of 30 days notice to cancel the billing for the above customer number when it is due for renewel on 16th Nov 05 which is associated with the domain name of �xxxxx.com� as this domain is no longer required.
If I can be of any further assistance please do feel free to contact me either by phone or email or at the address above."
The CAB staff advised me to contact trading standards with this which they will also be doing themselves and too write to BFS by recorded delivery explaining what they had advised me to do also explaining that I had spoke to CAB and they were contacting trading standards themselves and they were extremely eager for me to keep them informed of BFS's response to my letter.
They also advised that I should put in a claim for all my time and expenses etc against BFS via the
ONLINE SMALL CLAIMS COURT AT
https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/csmco2/index.jsp
Or via the small claims court documents held at any local library
Of course first thing monday morning I shall be in touch with Trading standards as advised and setting off the process of claiming against BFS, as it has cost me a lot more than their �25 in wasted time off work sitting in a CAB office along with phone calls and letters etc.
Many thanks to Chris Holdcrofts who's dealings with OneandOne is one of the entries below for taking the time to give me the benefit of his experiance.
If your interested below is a catolog of my events but if you have read any of the entries below by other people mine are very similar so you may get a touch bored reading mine.-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Basically I ran my own web design company some years ago and ordered two really good domain names for a client.
xxxxx.co.uk
Which is still up and running but has since being transferred to another Hosting company.
Also
xxxxx.com
Both initially registered with 1and1, but only the .com was left with them, I registered both to protect the client�s website from being mistaken with some other company if they took up the .com variation of xxxxx
I ceased trading and to be honest completely forgot about the domain xxxxx.com still with 1and1,
Until Dec 2004 I noticed that my debit card had being debited for about �10, not much I know, but its better off in my pocket than theirs.
So I rang 1and1 and queried this only to be told that it was an automatic feature that was in the initial TnCs which I signed up too, which I�m sure it wasn�t as I would have noticed this that�s for sure.
Anyway they told me it was too late to stop it now, and if I wanted to stop it next year (2005), I would have to write a letter nearer to the expiry date and send it in to them giving them at least 30 days notice. I duly did this by typing a standard cancellation letter giving them actually 2 months notice and also letting them know that the web design company no longer traded.
I of course left it at that which was Sept 11th 05, I heard nothing more and of course thought no more about it, and why should I as I never had the beneifit of knowing what I now know, ie how hard it is to cancel.
Then BFS finance get in on the act Jan of this year with a letter addressed to my old web design business, I had heard nothing at all from anyone between sending a letter off in Sept of last year cancelling a product I no longer required, until BFS sent me a letter telling me I now owe them �25 in total, for a product I�ve cancelled and have heard nothing more about, not even a letter or email etc letting me know that the domain was about to expire in 30 days etc and did I wish to renew it etc which of course would of alerted me to the fact that they had not received the letter I sent off, a letter similar to many we have all sent off in the past cancelling products/services we no longer require, with one big difference, too companies who make it relatively easy to cancel.
I rang BFS up as the letter stated not to contact 1and1 and deal purely with BFS, I spoke to a young lady who said she would email 1and1 on my behalf to see what they had to say and get back to me. As I like most people in life are busy with every day family life I forgot to chase this up with BFS as they never contacted me until a month later which was feb this year with a similar letter to the 1st letter. I rang them again and spoke to a completely arrogant young man who was a little like a recorded message, simply telling me I had breached the TnCs of 1and1s.
I mentioned about the previous call to one of his colleagues to which he wasn�t remotely interested in.
I told him I no longer wanted a product they appear to be doing as little as humanly possible to make sure I have plenty of notice and opportunity to cancel, and that I did as first advised by 1and1s customer support and sent in a letter cancelling the product. He simply kept repeating himself saying really arrogantly and aggressively
�Did you get confirmation that it was cancelled NO, so that means it�s not cancelled until you are told so by 1and1 OK�.
Of course at this point I wanted to drag him by the throat down the phone line,
some how unbelievably keeping my composure I said why should a 43 year old man be treated like some chastised little school boy and have to wait until he is told that he does not have to keep a product he no longer requires and wait to be told that its ok, he does not have to pay for the product even though he has given the company 60 days notice and has not received ANY correspondence from them offering him any option to cancel or notification that the domain was about to expire which of course would of alerted me to the fact that they had not received the letter I sent in.
He just kept repeating his statement about the TnCs at which I said ok we are going round in circles here and achieving nothing I suggest we terminate this conversation as we are both getting a little irate.
Next contact from BFS was a letter this morning from their other dept Smiths Solicitors using the scare tactics letting me know that if it goes to court I will be responsible for the court fees set out below
BALANCE DUE NOW �25.45p
Court fees at least �30
Solicitors costs �50
Total amount payable �105.45p
Then with the usual statement about it affecting your credit rating etc etc
What a sham and palava just to cancel a product/service you/me/we no longer require,
Dont you pay them, get yourself some proper advice, along with the CAB and Trading standards and small claims court, most towns/cities have solicitors who will gladly give you the initial half hour consultation free of charge, thats all you need.
Also, dont forget to check your house insurance as you may find that you get free legal advice by telephone on your Buildings and Contents insurance
Will I be paying them,
What do you think.
Roy
Guest
15:16 10/03/06
Re: Aren't there laws against this??!
Re "Aren't there laws against this??!" posted by russellk at 20:00 11/01/06 ...
Hi
I have just Googled ("1 & 1" smiths scam) and found your message.
The same has happened to me except that it is the second year running!
What have you done about this?
I have complained to a PC mag that still have ads for 1 & 1 about it but what else??
Re: 1&1 Internet Ltd, Twisted Contract terms & Fraud
Re "1&1 Internet Ltd, Twisted Contract terms & Fraudulen" posted by sureweld at 8:37 05/03/06 ...
BFS Finance stands for Bertelsmann Financial Services. Bertalmanns are a huge multinational company who own amounst other things Sony. (Sony BMG - Betalmanns Media Group)
I also received a letter from BFS Finance re an outstading amount ot 1&1.
I checked my details and found my credit card expiry date was wrong as I had been issued a new card since my last payment. I received no communication from 1&1 about this just the letter from BFS.
I called BFS and got a recorded message. I left details but have not yet received a reply. I have also e-mailed them.
I have cancelled my 1&1 acount online and activated the cancellation as described in a previous post.
This is not the way decent comapnies do business.
I have referred 1&1 to the Office of Fair Trading.
1&1 Internet Ltd, Twisted Contract terms & Fraudulen
A "WEALTH WARNING" about 1 & 1 Internet Ltd
Last October 2005, I cancelled a few domain names (Contract No. 6570491) that I had from 1 & 1 Internet and cancelled them by the method required in 1 & 1�s contract, weeks before the names became due for payment renewal.
January 2006 arrives and so did a debt collection letter from BFS Finance Ltd (the preferred partner of 1&1 Internet Ltd) demanding payment or they would either instruct solicitors to contact me or if appropriate, pay me a visit (bring them on!) I contacted 1&1 and was informed that the domain names were not cancelled and only BFS Finance Ltd could deal with this �debt�. I have (had) other domain names through 1&1 and using another domain name, which had another contract number, contacted 1&1 again. The �pigeon English� speaking person at 1&1 billing, eventually told me how to cancel my domain name with 1&1 and be sure it is cancelled. I was initially told to follow my contract requirements but eventually told that I could also go to www.contract.oneandone.co.uk, enter the account number and password and cancel or change the account / package from there. This I did, and 1&1 make it as awkward as they can for customers to cancel accounts, but I eventually received their e-mail telling me to follow yet another link. (Failure to do this will deem the contract active again) After following instructions on the linked page, I received an e-mail a few days later confirming the cancellation of my account & contract. Great ! The next day another e-mail arrived from 1&1, thanking me for not cancelling the contract and welcoming me back to 1&1 bla, bla, bla ! I expect BFS Finance Ltd will be in touch some time in the future!!
After sending BSF Finance 5 e-mails explaining things about my domain name cancellations last October, BFS wanted me to send proof of my cancellation, that done, then they wanted further proof that I had cancelled before last years 'billing date' Then they e-mailed further demands wanting more documentation sent, along with anything they apparently could dream up, trying to force me to pay for 1&1�s fraudulent debt claim. Then alas, a letter arrived from SMITHS (BSF�s Solicitors) PO Box No. 232, The Hall, Beverley, HU17 6AL. It�s the same address as BSF Finance Ltd, so does the �S � taken from B�S�F Finance Ltd mean Solicitors? SMITHS tell me not to reply to their letter, just to pay up within 15 days with payment payable to BSF Finance, (or what ? a visit ?) At least Dick Turpin had the decency to wear a mask !
Don't be taken in, as I was by 1 & 1 Internet's big glossy adverts (which customers will help pay for) and enticing 'initial' low cost domain names etc, with a contract drafted to protect 1&1's commercial needs.This contract does not take account of the customers interests and rights. Read the wording in the 1 & 1 contract, it only protects 1&1's commercial interests and wealth, contrary to the requirement of Unfair Terms in Consumer Contract Regulations. 1 & 1's contract causes a significant imbalance between the customer and 1& 1''s rights and obligations under this contract, to the customers detriment.
Guest
22:50 03/03/06
1and1 nightmare
Dear all
For those of you with the following;
Delicate disposition/Smugness/Relative of Clive Lockwood/ Geek/Know it all/Never made a mistake/Weak heart
Please look away
My journey of disaster started 2 years ago and I will catalogue it accordingly in brief one-liners.
Got on train at company called Concept Websites ltd; 1st mistake (you will see I make a few)
Had brainwave to develop next Google based around the terms Whysites.com aka Whylondon / Whyfootball / Whynike etc etc 2nd mistake, my office manager informed me I could have had Whysites.com/+all my derivatives…. ah well to late onwards and upwards, or downwards as it happens.
Bought up my stock of domain names from 1and1.co.uk, 3rd mistake, to the tune of approx �5000, yes �5k, I had a whale of a time, I really thought I was onto something as I signed up for my novel and unique names, which as I was on a role included number derivatives, 1ook.com/1ofts.com/1oans.com etc etc
I paid my money and got stuck into developing the monster, which was to become a tadpole of a project.
Work, as it does got in the way, and the promised help and advice went AWOL…. My dream of a job became a nightmare and on receiving an invoice from 1and1in July 2005 (I purchased all my domain names in a spell from June 04 to late July 04) I asked my Office Manager for advice 4th mistake, “ignore it they cant make you have the names if you don’t want them”, bearing in mind this guy has been dealing in web names for clients for years I took said advice and proceeded to check which ones to keep as I still had visions (double ones) of getting it going again.
Then the 1st threatening letter arrived from BFS Finance, a bit steep as it was for about �58 and I had had no correspondence from 1and1 indicating that this was worthy of a visit from a bailiff??? So I called them and then things got really interesting, they pointed me back to 1and1 and numerous phone calls to foreign sounding gentlemen began. I soon realised that this was to be the precursor of a whole plethora of emails, telephone calls, faxes and further invoices.
Despite my pleas to 1and1 it was only after one gentleman informed me of my control panel and the ability to cancel agreements, cancel? I thought I had an agreement for 12 months? , that I then spent days printing off cancellation forms, and the repeated failed attempts at faxing these to 1and1 in a desperate attempt to halt my nightmare.
Needless to say even having received confirmation of cancellation of these contacts they insist on my paying back approx �4000. The letters really started dropping through the letterbox now, eventually a young lady on being told by me of the fact that I was unemployed and unable to pay this amount for something I have never even developed or used and indeed made every attempt to cancel in time, suggested I contact my Citizens Advice Bureau, who in turn would need to produce a statement of affairs to confirm my financial standing, or lack of it!!!
Through all of this I was fighting to clear my name through an Industrial Tribunal for dismissal from my old employees, I have since won my case, a bit empty as I enjoyed the job. And things went very quiet until lo and behold the demands for an increased amount have now started from a relocated BFS, conveniently moved to Beverley about 60 miles from me.
I also discovered a whole raft of other people having similar, if not as costly as my own, disputes with 1and1, a company I thought, before my experience to be a reputable large hosting provider?
So if you are still with this and can see through watery eyes!!! I am open to any and all advice on whether to use the Humber bridge for what some might consider a worthy cause, and jump, or any help on how to go forward.
I admit to having been na�ve in many things in my life, but I have always treat others how I would like to be treat, and in this life has been very kind in giving me Health and Happiness a lovely Wife and two lads whom I cant seem to dislodge from our home, gifted them with brains enough to not buy �0000 worth of websites, go to college and have the same happy outlook on life, because, despite all of this I will still smile and enjoy life, albeit with the threat of the bailiffs knocking on my door.
Thanks for your time and any advice or assistance, not money, I will only buy more web names…………..
Re "How do I sort out a refund?" posted by TommyC at 15:42 24/02/06 ...
I've got exactly the same problem. I ordered a Managed Server 1 on February 5th 2006. There was no notice on the website that these server are out of stock. After I had completed the order I got an email saying the server is *temporarily* out of stock and should be available in about a week. After a week I telephoned them and was told it could be another 2 weeks. Yesterday I called them again and was told they still do not know when this server will be ready. What's more, they are still advertising these servers and during 1 call to them I was told I was 7th on the list to get one - god knows how many people are waiting now. This is starting to really p*** me off - especially when the idiots that answer the phone cannot understand English
I'm nobodys mug, if it was any other company I'd have jumped ship straight away. But i've already got about 20 servers with them and they are super reliable (the best i've had and i've tried lots of companies). Once you get up and running you almost never have to call them - which is a blessing because their customer service is absolutely abysmal.
I ordered a Business Root server way back in mid-january from 1&1 only to be informed that the server was out of stock and that they were awaiting hardare to be delivered for this service which could be up-to two weeks?!
I was only aware that the server was unavailable once my card details had been processed! This server was purchased to host my client's websites and fortunately they were prepared to wait so gave 1&1 the benefit of the doubt.
Two weeks elapsed still no server and no info from 1&1 to infom otherwise. I contacted Tech support to be told that the server was available, which it was not. Spoke to another tech support person and was told that it will be a further two weeks until the server will go live (1 MONTH) and they were still advertising the product as in stock?!
As my client and my company grew impatient we went straight to Web Fusion and ordered a server from them and on the very same day we could set up the server and up load all our client websites.
I wrote once again to 1&1 stating that they has breached their purchasing contract as we should have received our service ordered within 30 days and requested an immediate refund, however because we had purchased domains under the same account I didn't want to terminate the entire account as the A & MX records were pointing to our Web Fusion Server.
Tech support via phone is very confusing due to accent/language barriers and no-one could lead me through the process of cancelling the Server, keeping my domains and getting a refund?!
Today I was informed that the server has gone live (well over 30 days from date of order) and all my domains were re-set to point to the 1&1 server so just have updated these grrrr.
If anyone can advise how I best to resolve the issue of getting a refund for the server but keeping the domains at 1&1 then this would help as I now have a server that i'm paying for not in use!!!!
never had any probs with 1&1 regarding general service, cancellation of packages/ contracts etc.
as a matter of fact they provide a reasonably good deal overall.
just transferred a domain last mon. - all done & completed by control panel & email within 24hrs.
I'm the owner of www.bankraid.com (formerly www.thebleedingobvious.com).
People are not just coming forward to complain about 1&1 just for the 'fun of it'. There are numerous serious issues to be addressed for which 1&1 remain silent.
I was commenting to the owner of www.wasitfree.com the other day that being a customer of 1&1 is like living in a prison camp. A bit extreme perhaps, but bear with me ...
Imagine two prisoners of war (POWs) chatting to each other. One says: "The food here is great, we are treated well and everything is quite cosy". The second POW says: "Yes, but have you ever tried to leave?"
I refer specifically (of course) to 1&1's contract cancellation facility, amongst other issues. 1&1 may be cheap, but you get what you pay for. If you keep your mouth shut and don't complain, you are OK. But God forbid you do open your mouth and say something 1&1 doesn't like! Then the 'prison guards' will take away your privileges and stick you in 'solitary confinement'.
Try to leave and you have to get over obstacles seemingly designed to make life difficult for you.
Ergo, 1&1 wants you as a compliant, non-complaining customer. Outside of that, watch out!
Anyone want to join my escape committee??? A tunnel is being dug at: www.bankraid.com!
Guest
18:25 25/01/06
Re: 1 and 1 blackmail & 'free' .info's -- BS!
Re "Re: 1 and 1 blackmail" posted by fluoride3 at 5:43 15/01/06 ...
Here's been my recent experience with those supposedly 'free' .info's from 1&1:
I've recently been going around & around with 1&1 re: them jacking up my 'final' invoice (PDF file they send days later) price for several domain orders.
They've finally corrected the initial order/invoice since (apparently) they had no grounds to dispute it. It was the first domain-order which included their recent "free .info's" offer.
So they agreed (after emails & a call to Billing) to refund those 5 .info's which they had charged me for.
Of course I'm wondering how many others never realized they were actually billed for higher than they expected?? (guy told me it was 'glitch' in the system--interesting that glitches Rarely favor the customer!)
But the problem remains with several additional domain-orders I placed just after the one that included the new 'free .info' offer.
On each of several orders for domains, even After I had fully logged in (so their system Knew it was me/my-account), 4~5 of the .info's were showing up as $0.00 & the total order amount also reflected those free .info's.
So I placed the orders & got printouts/recipts each time--clearly showing the 'free' .info's & total amounts that reflected the free ones, along with all my name/accout information.
THEN, they send me the PDF's (invoices) several days later which all show Higher amounts that they were charging my credit card!
It's like going to a store, making a purchase for a product that costs $10, paying with credit card, getting a receipt that shows the item cost $10, but then later the store actually charges your credit card for $50 !
This can't be right.
They are lamely claiming that their system needed time to reconcile the fact
that I'd already gotten my limit of 5 free .info's. That's absurd. Especially by a Big Multi-National Corp that routinely handles/manages giant databases.
I've called billing once & emailed several times (to both Billing & Complaint Dept) --being detailed & polite, but they are basically bouncing me around & brushing me off.
So I'm preparing now to pursue via my credit card company, the BBB, the FTC, my state's Attorney General, & a lawyer &/or a class-action lawsuit.
Re "Re: 1 and 1 blackmail" posted by RealRockMan at 11:54 14/01/06 ...
Firstly, I have had unexplained log-in problems with my other username 'fluoride'. So now, I'm 'fluoride3'.
Re: last few postings on 1&1 and the threats they make. Yes, they are very unlikely to take someone to court. It's much easier to trash their credit rating / spoil their credit history - and then put the onus upon the victim to go to court to rectify this.
And yes, courts will take a dim view of any company that tries to enforce a debt on a contract which has been clearly cancelled. Thats just one more reason why 1&1 hasn't got the integrity or the guts to pursue debts they cannot enforce. However, it does not prevent the distress some people are caused when they are threatened or visited by debt collectors.
My advice? Try the Cooperative Bank. They have a facility where you can cancel direct debits and such without prior permission of the company you are doing business with. You simply log-into your bank account and the cancellation process is just a few clicks away. Simple as that. Need further help? Please visit my website www.thebleedingobvious.com (or www.bankraid.com).
In closing I would say that 1&1 are not alone in their pursuit of innocent victimes. It is a modern trend for some companies to sign-up people to contracts, get their bank details and then try to ignore any cancellation of contract. Nobody likes to lose business and some companies will do everything possible, even where it is unethical, and even illegal, to ensure they keep taking money off you.
Dick turpin may have been a folk hero, but it's now time we bought to justice the 'internet highwaymen' and make them 'hang' for their crimes.
Re "1 and 1 blackmail" posted by Blackmailed at 18:48 27/12/05 ...
Unfortunately for you (and I do sympathise with you) a debt exists at the moment when it is due. So if you have an annual renewal either by Direct Debit or charge to your credit card, the charge is payable at that date. Failure to make due payment causes the non-payment to become a debt for which a company may take legally enforceable steps to obtain the monies due.
To prevent a company from carrying out such action you need to write to them with a dated letter to their contact address informing them in writing that you no longer wish to make payment and are cancelling the arrangement. In this respect word processors are a wonderful device as you can write a letter to the company AFTER they demand payment, such letter needs to be dated ahead of the due date for payment.
In my experience companies rarely pursue the matter beyond this when presented with a Prima facie evidence that you cancelled the arrangement in writing prior to the due date. County Courts take a dim view of company's that pursue claims which have been cancelled in writing where you can produce a copy of the letter that you sent prior to the due date. It's not your fault if they say they didn't receive it, unless they have informed you in writing at the time when the arrangement was set up, that any cancellation must be done in writing and sent by Recorded Delivery with proof of delivery.
From reading these posts I am extremely disappointed that I ever chose 1&1 for my web hosting. I have just received one of those infamous demand letters from "Smiths" - the ones whose office is in a brothel by the sound of it. That nugget of information didn't surprise me in the slightest. They want �100 over the amount that I owe to 1&1 due to my credit card expiring and my not refreshing my details on my 1&1 account. I have looked back through my Inbox to see that 1&1 did actually notify me that my details were about to expire... come to think of it I think it went straight to my junk email at the time (accidental? I wonder...)
OK, admittedly I suppose I should have done that at the time, but I forgot. It amazes me that the FIRST thing I hear is from a debt collector slapping a big fine on the due amount and threatening court action. NO warning emails, NO "Urgent" payment notices, NO phone calls - NOTHING. Is this legal? I am currently investigating UK business law to see if I can find anything that states any procedures a company MUST go through before passing the owed amount to debt collectors. Does anybody have any ideas on this? E.g. a number of warnings that must be sent out, or confirmed direct contact with the client...? I guess I'm just being hopeful really, but from the sound of these posts, it wouldn't surprise me if 1&1 were flouting some laws somewhere along the line.
By the way, I received this letter from Smiths TODAY (11/01/06) stating that I have 15 days to pay before their "client will consider commencing County Court proceedings against you". The letter is dated 28/12/05, and 15 days conveniently brings us to TOMORROW for the deadline. This is clearly a dirty trick by Smiths, rather than any delays in the postal service. People like me will receive the letter, work out the date, and PANIC - "Oh my god, if I don't pay this tomorrow, I'll be taken to court!". Thus not allowing the victim enough time to properly consider what is being done to them, or investigate the matter in any detail. Only just enough time to pay. I'm really having to try hard to hold back on the swear words here.... 1&1 are a bunch of criminals, as I have now realised.
I want to keep the domain names - should I pay up the debt or waste my time and effort fighting? I think class action against them is a great idea, although I'm not sure if my case would be applicable.
In conjunction with www.thebleedingobvious.com there is a site that is aimed at those people that, like overselves, were duped by the 'free' .info domain offer.
We have amassed a fair number of members, but we STILL need your help to mount the group action case. Those of you that havn't already, please do get in touch and together we can band together and DEMAND justice.
Members will be gains a webpage to chronical their plight and access to the closed group site that is co-ordinating the group-action lawsuit.
I bought several domain name packages from 1 and 1 in 2004 for the duration of a year totalling over $600. No problems, until a year later, they send me an e-mail saying they�re going to charge my credit card for renewal for another year! I never authorized renewal for another year.
I cancelled my credit card, but they still went ahead and billed my account and now my account is in collections. They say I owe them over $600 for something I didn�t even authorize. I can�t afford to pay this, but at the same time I don�t want my credit rating to get screwd up�I feel like I�m being blackmailed! I went to antifraud.com and am in the process of reporting them to several of the organizations mentioned on that website. I suggest you guys do the same�the more people that report these �theives�, the more chance that somebody in authority will do something.
I've just had the oft-reported letter from "Smiths" - with a PO Box in Beverley near Hull, despite the registered address (in small print) being Covent Garden - in which they threaten county court action, quoting �30 court fees and �50 solicitors costs (sic). I've replied pointing out that as this would be the Small Claims Procedure (�30 being the fee for this), the winning party can't claim any costs over and above the court fee. Plus I'd be asking for transfer of proceedings to my local court, as is the right of the defendant. Let's see if this (common?) knowledge has them on the back foot.
I've also pointed them to grumbletext, and to the sterling work on t'bleedingobvious, just in case they don't realise we know about their shady practices (hollow laugh)
Just to let you know that the website exposing 1&1's unethical trading practices is still going strong. And now it's been joined by a sister site to represent the interests of 'the group' (a growing band of unhappy customers who want to sue 1&1).
So, without further ado, please bookmark these two websites:
www.awaywolf.com/bleedingobvious/ (for news and publicity) and www.wasitfree.com (for group / legal action).
And please do not forget, regardless of whether you were stung by 1&1 on the so-called 'free' .info offer of 2004, get in touch. We want to hear from anyone who feels they have been unfairly 'relieved' of their hard-earned cash by 1&1.
Re "Re: Result... ... Maybe??!!" posted by garethwait at 10:25 08/12/05 ...
So they actually wrote off the outstanding balance due to non-payment? Ha! Well done, although I'm not sure that makes sense!!
I just got a reply to a message sent concerning the second cancellation request form I sent them in November (don't get excited - you'll be surprised at their response!!):-
"Unfortunately we have not received a cancellation request for this account.
The cancellation procedure has now been modified and you are able to complete
the process online by following the instructions below.
The outstanding amount of �10.45 is for the registration of your domain for the
period 30.09.05-30.09.06, as it was not cancelled from the system before this
date. Therefore the debt has been passed to BFS as it is fully valid and would
need to be paid to them.
HOW TO CANCEL ---------------------------------------------------------------
In order to process a cancellation we require you to follow our online
procedure.
Please go to http://contract.oneandone.co.uk and log in with your customer id
and password, when you are within here select the package that you would like to
close, or contains the domain name to close, and then follow the on screen
steps.
At the end of the process you will receive an e-mail to the address supplied on
your control panel containing a specific website link. If you do not receive an
e-mail with this special cancellation confirmation link, please contact our
expert Support Team at [email protected].
To activate your cancellation request and complete the process you must follow
the link e-mailed to you."
Wow! Naturally they did not receive the cancellation for the account last year! It was only sent in the same e-mail that allowed them to process the payment for last year and yet they read that bit!!
The 'new' procedure must have come about yesterday because they were adament that I needed to send them a form by post or fax prior to that!! (They couldn't accept a scanned in signed copy on an e-mail though - the difference pray tell)?
"Please clarify 'written off and terminated'
I look forward to your prompt reply
Gareth Wait"
I just got...
"Dear Gareth Wait, (Cust: xxxxxxx)
Thank you for your email.
Your account has been fully cancelled from our system which means we do not hold your domains anymore.The outstanding balance has been written off due to non payment."
Sounds like an end to it, aside from www.trubey.co.uk - ho hum.......
Re "Result... ... Maybe??!!" posted by garethwait at 16:18 07/12/05 ...
Don't count on it. They did the same to me and I breathed a sigh of relief only to be sent a letter for a debt collector threatening legal action... Give it a week or so!
This is to inform you that your account has been written off and terminated due to non payment
PLEASE NOTE. For your convenience we also list the answers to many frequently asked questions on our website. Please check here before emailing us as it may save you time.
All billing questions are to be found at www.faq.1and1.co.uk under the contract and billing section.
If you have any further questions do not hesitate to contact us.
Kind regards
Nushrath Mansoor
Billing Department
1&1 Internet Ltd.
..... does that mean they've given up? 'written off' certainly sounds like it to me!
I got 25 free, no obligation, .info domains from 1and1 a year ago and now, a year later, they've billed me to keep them on for another year without asking me. I'm totally stressed out about this. I thought that with domains it was the case that you were detagged unless you explicitly paid for renewal at the end of the year.
Obviously 1and1 don't work like this. Sadly I did not know this.
Can I fight paying this invoice?
Please, anyone with advice, contact me at [email protected]. Any advice you can give would be greatly appreciated.
Michael.
Guest
12:26 02/12/05
Re: Cancelling a contract with 1 & 1 leaving a bitter ta
yes, i am considering sending them an invoice for their time.
but you know they will never pay.
They staff are so usless and apathetic which is just the mentality of the whole company.
I actually looked at 1 and 1 terms and conditions whilst on the phone with BFS and i found the cancellation policy and the guy didn't believe me, he said "you can't have found it that fast" um... yes i did, ever heard of CTRL + F??
its disgusting that companies are allowed to get away with this.
Cancelling a contract with 1 & 1 leaving a bitter taste
I though I was alone in a battle with 1 & 1 and their minders, BFS Finance, when I tried to cancel my contract with them. Oh no I'm not - just one of many, as this thread shows.
I've just sent off my "bill" to BFS for the time spent trying to explain things to them. Meanwhile, they are threatening court action (or sending the boys round, whichever takes their fancy). Time will tell...
I cancelled with 1 and 1, and then the set up my domains anyway, and they claim that they didn't get my notification, when i know they did because they replied.
I also changed my address in the same notification, which goes to show they must have lost it because without warning or notification they passed on my details to BFS, who sent letters to an address i haven't lived at for years.
1 and 1 are an utter utter disgrace i was so supprised to find out that you have all had the same problems
BFS are rubbish you can never get hold of them. Then when you do they dont care, and more than that, the guy i spoke to "Arron" or "Amon" was telling me that i was in breach of the terms and conditions and when i asked him to read the part that specifically pointed it out, he couldn't because he didn't have a copy, which just shows they are liars and just make most of it up. Ontop of this he actually pretended to Call 1and1 which he didn't as i could hear him, clearly NOT on the phone to them.
im tempted to print this entire thread out and post it to 1 and 1.
For a group action (or multi-party claim) to be valid there is a minimum of 10 members required. Different rules apply for the funding of such cases, which may be of assistance to many of us.
I would appreciate if anyone that would be willing to support a group-claim drop me an email at [email protected] and I will collect details, etc. If we can get more than ten I will approach a few of the leading law firms with a view to sounding them out.
I look forward to hearing you tales of woe at the hands of 1&1 Internet.
Well, I've had a letter this morning from the Debt Collection Agency (BFS) .... complete with a late payment charge of �15.00! The one thing I find strange is that the letter was delivered this morning (30th November), but is dated 22nd November - almost a week ago, so maybe I'll get another one tomorrow with another �15.00 charge for 'non-payment within a week'!!
Can I suggest that anyone with a problem goes through the online small claims court? I did, and after much arguing of the case with 1&1, many threats (mostly from them), etc etc, it was finally resolved.
The most annoying thing for me was that, even after everything, they still had the gall to try to suggest that it was my own fault.. and that they were doing me a favour by repaying a proportion of my expenses.
They didn't repay me 100% of my expenses I should point out, they paid maybe 60%.
It's a despicable company to deal with, and it's a great shame that so few people will know until the day that a problem arises.
A 1&1 Internet Domain Hosting is for LIFE, not just for Christmas.............. unfortunately for your bank account.
I fell foul of the 'free' domain/autorenew scam - and am currently in a pointless dialogue with billing. The 'debt' has been passed to (BFS), but I have heard nothing from them....
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